Sorry, I know. ANOTHER thread? Hopefully I don't get in hot water for starting yet another thread to argue whether tanking is a smart move, but I have something to say to the pro tanking people. Look, I get it. We need a superstar. We aren't having any luck in trading for one (it's hard) or picking one up in free agency (buncha primadonnas). I understand what you're saying about how we're mediocre right now. I'm not arguing against that either. I also agree that getting bad can make you good quickly. Hell, how do you think we drafted Yao? I also understand that this is a shortened season so tanking won't be as painful this year as it would be in the future. And, I also see that this could be a special draft where anyone in the top ten could easily be a future NBA superstar. So why am I against tanking? Well, don't you think other teams have thought about all those things too? How many teams that are destined to not make the playoffs this year do you think will just simply tank? How many teams that think they may be decent will actually be terrible? How many teams do you think may have key injuries that will cause them to be terrible? Lets take a look at who we have to be worse than: New Orleans (good luck with that one)- last year 46-36 Cleveland (again, good luck)- last year 19-63 Washington- last year 23-59 Toronto- last year 22-60 Minnesota (not buying they'll suddenly be good)- last year 17-65 Charlotte (now with less talent)- last year 34-48 Phoenix (one Nash injury or trade away...)- last year 40-42 Sacramento (Hayes isn't going to save that team)- last year 24-58 Detroit (wow bad)- last year 30-52 New Jersey (barring a D12 trade I can't see DWill turning this around THAT much)- last year 24-58 Philadelphia (respectable last year sorta but you don't think they may tank?) last year 41-41 Denver (No JR no Carmelo no Kenyon or Wilson Chandler)- last year 50-32 Utah (No DWill no Kirelenko, Devin made of glass)- last year 39-43 Portland (god only knows what could go wrong next)- last year 48-34 Golden State (I see no reason they'll suddenly improve)- last year 36-46 That's 15 teams that could easily be absolutely terrible. I'll admit I doubt Portland to fall that mightily but hell, all it would take is a LaMarcus injury. Even if we traded away Martin and Scola and went from there do you really think a team led by Lowry will accept laying down and dying without a fight? Can you say the same for many of these teams' leaders? Just remember. We could either go for the playoffs making us instantly a better viewed franchise league wide, gives our players much needed experience, exposure, and confidence, and improves our "assets" for a future trade. OR we can race to the bottom against that crowd and STILL conceivably only obtain the 14th pick. I say go for it! I want Houston to be as proud of our Rockets as they are currently of the Texans. Hell, the Texans might not make it out of the first game of the playoffs but people will notice. I want the same for the Rockets don't you?
The problem is that we are not one piece away from being a championship contender. We are a superstar away from being a contender. We're stuck being mediocre. We need to either trade for a superstar (which hasn't worked up till now) or we need to draft one. The best way to do that is tank and trade away the older players. After on or two drafts, along with our younger assets, we have a chance to be a much better playoff team.
Morey has been great at drafting, not so great at trading....so I will take my chances with where he has been great more often. DD
Again. You SURE we can out bad all those teams? The kind of franchise changing player you're talking about is VERY rare. Probably will only be two at the most MAYBE three players in this loaded draft. Could be NO players like that next draft. Even if we actively TRIED to be bad we could easily end up with the 8th or 9th pick. Just good enough to pick someone that would only end up being about as good as Martin or Scola is now. Hell, people here didn't even want Gasol. Where do you think he'd draft at?
Make a list of the 10 best players under 30, and name one of them that we have even a remote chance of acquiring. Case closed. It's time to tank.
Are people even reading the original post or are they just reading the title and immediately saying what they've said in EVERY thread where tanking is brought up??? No one even remotely discussing the problems with tanking I laid out. :\ To all those coming on here saying tank, if we did, where do you predict we would pick in the draft?
Take Martin and Scola away from this team, and with no Hayes, and this team might very well be one of the worst teams in the league. Bottom five for sure. Take off the Rockets colored glasses folks. This team sucks without Martin and Scola. If we want to be a contender - we have to NOT sign any free agents for multi-year contracts - in fact, dump salary. Get younger, not older. And pray that Scola and Martin get non-career serious, but definitely season ending injuries. Otherwise we are stuck where we were for the past 3 years - no man lands.
Just win 0 games. At least we will tie with other strong tanking teams. I don't know how hard is to lose all the games but we have to try our best before giving up and settling for the mediocrity.
For the umpteenth time no is saying purposefully tank, what we are saying is play the young guys instead of signing stopgaps like Dalembert/Fysenko, etc. All guys like Dalembert do is keep you in mediocrity so what's the friggin point? As a fan I would much rather watch high potential guys like TWill and Thabeet who may never pan out then vets who have already reached their rather low ceilings.
He hasn't been great at either in my opinion, but drafting is going to be where we get back to greatness.
Hey, I'm not saying I want to sign someone that won't make us significantly better but could tie up future flexibility. But some people here have lost their mind thinking that somehow tanking would be easy to do and would fix all our problems. There are people here who actually didn't even want Gasol and Nene because they didn't think it could beat the Heat or Dallas There's a big difference between getting Gasol and Nene from getting Dalembert and Fysenko.
I said he has been great at drafting......what are you so upset about? Trading is much harder than drafting, with a trade you have 30 other teams after the same guy, in the draft, when it is your pick, you are in charge. I will take my shots in the draft. DD
You rascal, you changed what you wrote before I could quote it, this is what I was responding too....lol. DD
Let me put it this way... Which would be better. Getting the 6-10th pick and losing Martin and Scola Getting the 14th pick and keeping Martin and Scola? Making the playoffs? Cause I don't see any way we'll be worse than Cleveland, New Orleans, Charlotte, Toronto, or Washington. Hell I don't even see us being worse than Minnesota or Detroit NO MATTER WHO WE PLAY. Remember. Other teams are thinking about being bad too and they already were VERY bad to begin with.
I'm anti-tanking myself, and I agree with (I think) all of your points in this thread, but... After the demoralizing rescinding of the Gasol trade, the resulting absurd losing of Hayes and the inability to find a center for the team since, I am finding myself more and more in favor of Morey blowing up and rebuilding this team. I want to see players like Martin traded for young players or future picks, I want the team not to concentrate on winning now, but instead on how to construct a championship roster in the future. However, I wouldn't say the team should tank or just give away players like Martin and Scola. The team should get younger and take risks by trading good players for potentially great players who may go bust (think 'right to Valanciunus' not 'Thabeet). So, without trying to lose, throw away players or tank the team could still better position itself for the future by focusing less on the present. So, to use your structure, what is better: 1) Getting the 14th pick and keeping Martin and Scola? 2) Getting the 6-10th pick, losing Martin and Scola, and trading for 2-3 young prospects each of whom could be an all-star level player...or out of the league in a few years. In the first option we know what we have: mediocrity. In the 2nd option we have a chance at something more. We could get a lot worse, but I would trust Morey more than almost anyone else to guide the team through that risky terrain and to identify the best talent in both the draft and trades for young players.
So by your logic, we're better than the Heat. I believe without Martin, Hayes and Scola, we'd easily of handled last years Heat without James, Wade and Bosh. Probably would be better than many playoff teams without their stars as well, considering our bench. Really don't see your point with this. Only contending teams with late round picks would want Scola/Martin. We have no choice but to try to improve with what we have, such as the proposed trade for Pau/Nene. Unless you want to be like the Clippers who tanked and sucked for 15 years, to finally get some players to build around. The Celtics, Bulls, ect sucked for similar lengths of time. I for one wouldn't want to watch the Houston version of the Clippers until 2025. There aren't Sampson's, Hakeem's or Yao's in every draft class...we were very lucky then. The Clippers didn't get lucky until their fourth no. 1 pick attempt, when Griffin finally panned out.
I am tired of this entire tanking argument. We are not going to tank, regardless of how we feel about it, or how anyone else feels about it, it isn't going to happen. Les will simply not let it happen. That's all there is to it.
The Magic might give us their 2013 1st round pick to try to win a championship this year with DH. If he leaves, then their pick might have a lot of value. We can give them a good player like Scola and/or Martin for that potentially high pick.
