The role of the Gov/Media in the Fear/Racism against MEs

NEWS FLASH: Ty_Webb Finally Outs Himself As A Racist ... Who Has "Come A Long Way"

So, the "we" you talk about in the first paragraph is not you, because that "we" only includes those Americans who are terrorizing Arab-Americans.

But, and this is the most revealing part, you do include yourself in the second "we". That "we" is the group of Americans who, by your own definition, rounded up Asian-Americans into containment camps. So, you consider yourself to be a person who would've supported a blatantly rasicst act during WWII.

Either that, or you like to change the definition of "we" to fit your needs.

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Cohen,

I don't think I've ever agreed with you any more whole-heartedly.

 

America definitely has a race realtions problem, especially compared to the middle east. If I went to Iraq, my blond hair, blued eyed ass wouldnt last 10 minutes. I would stick out like a sore thumb and would be killed for being an american. You complain about how bad it is here and how terrible our race relations are here. It is not like the arabs in the ME are so tolerant. Look at how they treat Jews, women, and then burn our flags because we dont believe in their crap. No place is perfect but the US is not the land of Satan either. I think people should stop complaining about how bad it is and start looking at how the glass is half full instead of otherwise. I am not saying things couldnt be better, but they could be a hell of a lot worse. Also, why is it the US's job to give humanitarian aid to every country in the whole world. Everyone complains about the US but when they get their ass in a snare, they always come asking us for help and we almost always give it.

 

Good argumentation, Ty_Webb!

It cracks me up. This is a very ambiguous situation-- suddenly our world is turned upside down and people expect EVERYTHING to go on just as before... otherwise they categorize you as a racist and a hate-monger.

Well, most things go on as before but not everything.

I APPLAUD the spirit of your responses. Don't surrender to the onslaught of these rabble-rousers who wish to characterize you as a racist and a hate-monger.

This is real life stuff (all gray); it's not an intellectual exercise (black and white).

 

Master Baiter,

Yeah, all those whiny minorities should just shut up and be glad they live here.

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Ty_Webb,

I don't know if you are really a racist. I hope you're not. But, from the time you joined this BBS, I've paid attention to your posts, and you have yet to give me a reason to think otherwise. I may never know, unless I meet you. Even then I may still not know. Heck, you may not even know (or realize). You can say you're not, and I won't be sure. You can say you are, and I won't be sure.

I'm not out to attack you, but (some of) your ideas are definitely targets of mine.

If you are an American, then you are part of the collective "we" when it is used to refer to Americans.

You cannot simply exclude yourself from the label of Americans when the topic is what we are doing wrong, but include yourself in the collective "we" when refering to what Americans are doing right. Either you are both, or neither. You can't take credit for all the good the U.S. does globally without also taking responsibility for all the improper things America does.

You have lumped MEs together, why do you then refuse to be lumped into the "we" or "Americans" term?

I'm not an idiot. I understand the natural "fear" (if you want to call it that) of people in this country when they see a person who looks to be of Arab descent. But, I also understand and Arab-American's fear (of retaliation by whites), an African-American's fear (of the police), a Caucasian-American's fear (of driving through a black neighborhood). I understand all of that. I can put myself in another person's shoes and feel what they would feel. But, a person's actions and a person's feelings are two very different things. If the other groups I mentioned don't have a right to act on their fear, then what gives any non-Arab-American the right to act on their's?

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RichRocket,

How is anyone labelling anyone else a "racist" just because of the events of last Tuesday? If they are, then they are very naive. Those who were racists before this incident are still racists now. There is not more racism now, just more examples of racist acts.

Let's say you're right, everything is gray and there is no black and white. That would mean that every person on the planet is a racist. The only difference would be the level of racist tendencies between people. I would probably go along with that.

So, if there were some "Racism Scale" from 0 - 100 (0 being Jesus or Muhammad and 100 being Hitler), where would you rank yourself? Where would others rank you?

 

Your response to my comment confounds me.

The only people that I have labeled as racist are the ones who have taken hateful actions on people because of their similarity to MEs.

 

Master Baiter,

I am not trashing our Country. I am not saying that it is worse than any other country.

Plain and simple, I am discussing wrongs that are happening to innocent individuals in this country.

 

Many are being threatened, some have been killed. Go tell THEM how much better we've gotten.

It is really irrelevant how much we have 'improved' anyway. Until we get an 'A+', people have to fight to improve it.

 

as for acts of terrorism by us citizens:

killing 1000+ innocent iraqi CHILDREN EVERY DAY because of HUMANITARIAN aid sanctions. you got a beef with iraq, punish the government, they're oppressive bastards, i got no problem with it, but why are you taking away a 3 year olds piece of bread?
in the last year alone this has amounted to.... oh i dont know... 10 times the magnitude of the wtc attack.

That is correct, Jamma 34.

We kill these children in partnership with Sadam Hussein. By blockading them and preventing them from killing their oil we give Hussein a choice: with the limited income he does have,stop providing internal security and therefore be overthrown or rebuild the public sewerage systems and potable water supplies in Bagdad and the other larger cities.

In response to international outrage we now allow him to sell some oil for food and medicines which are too little and too late to save the infants who are dying of diarrhea and other diseases from the poor sanitation.


About a year ago when things were more laid back I saw an interview with one of ex ambassadors to the Middle East. He was asked "when do you think that Iraq will be accepted back into the community of nations?". He replied" "not until oil hits $40 per barrel."

Given the present climate I doubt he would say that and if he did it would not be aired.

 

DREAMer: "Let's say you're right, everything is gray and there is no black and white. That would mean that every person on the planet is a racist. The only difference would be the level of racist tendencies between people. I would probably go along with that.

So, if there were some "Racism Scale" from 0 - 100 (0 being Jesus or Muhammad and 100 being Hitler), where would you rank yourself? Where would others rank you?"

RR: Okay, I'll play but I think the terminology is limiting. A racist would seem to be someone who has the potential to make even an unprovoked decision about another person SOLELY on race. I think there are very few people like that. A racist is a 100.

I'd say that I'm a 10-20. As I go through my life, I am aware of race. I've had friends and acquaintances from many places and of many races. I used to play a lot of basketball in the city parks; they were games which included both blacks and white and we got along well. We even had one guy nicknamed "A-rab" who was an Arab-- bad knees though forced him into early retirement!

No doubt there are some here who would grade me a 50-60 though-- especially now!

How about you?

BTW, I like your frank appraisal of the race issue. We are all on a continuum because we cannot ignore race as a characteristic. What is all important is how we use that information.

 

So, you would argue that if an innocent Arab-American was misstreated before the atrocity, its would be very bad. But now that the event occurred, it is now a 'gray' area?

Wrong is wrong. It is much easier to see that with clarity when you are the one feeling the sting of racism.

 

I haven't sensed that you would be high on that scale...but your support of Ty did raise some concerns . Again, I apologize if you feel that I was attacking you.

My main concern is that people understand how wrong it is to misstreat, or indirectly support the misstreatment of innocent people. You believe it to be excusable or at least understandable under some circumstances and I don't. We can leave it there.

 

cohen, gray is not justifying... it is confusing.

 

Glynch you certainly have a one sided view of this. What about the terms that Iraq agreed to in order to end the war? Why were the UN inspectors kicked out of Iraq years ago? Is the US responsible for Iraqi children dying or is it Saddam Hussein who's responsible for it? Saddam would rather spend money hiring scientists to build weapons of mass destruction than feed the children of Iraq. Iraq's problem is it's own fault. Just because the US is involved in something doesn't require you to dismiss all acountability from these particular nations that started wars and engaged in murdering the Kurds, etc.

 

Ty_Webb,

You don't know. People can form their own opinion of me by my actions and words, which is how opinions should be formed.

RichRocket has something when he says that all issues, including racism, are in a gray area. By this, I mean, people can change. I believe a person can go from being a militant member of the Black Panthers or the Ku Klux Klan, to being a non-racist person. Though, they'd probably have a higher score on my "Racism Scale" due to the residual effects of years of racist thought processes.