The subject keeps coming up on Game Threads so I figure its worth having its on Thread. The Astros are 1 game out and have all the momentum in the world right now so the question is whether Uncle D should bite the bullet and make a play for one of the best in the game. It would probably deplete the Farm System again and restart the rebuilding process along with 14 million on the books for half of this season and next but it would probably make us the Favorite in the Central and as we saw in 04 and 05 pitching wins in the playoffs. I am torn a bit but starting to lean toward the side of getting him just still not sure. Your Thoughts?
Moot point because the Stros don't have the pieces to get him. You'd have to give up Castro (C) for him for sure, but beyond him the Astros don't have have any blue chips to move.
In the long run I agree just not enough but the question is should they try? I remember the RJohnson's trade and how at last minute the Seattle Mariners were playing hardball thus we were able to sneak in and with a far less attractive package steal him away...Same thing could happen here if everything falls into place!
All depends on cost. You'd have to throw out different trade scenarios for me to say whether or not I'd do it. I have no idea what you'd ultimately have to give up to get Halladay. I know what the Blue Jays want, but so far they keep being told "no" by everyone else. They're asking too much at this point.
the problem is, we really don't have the quality of the players we gave up in the RJ deal back in 98.
Well there I disagree...Again we would be killing the rebuilding plan but I could see a BUD NORRIS, Castro, Lo and a young A ball pitcher package to atleast spark there interest. Its alot but if other teams dont want to deal maybe we can? I remember when we gave up Guillen, Garcia and Halama most people where shocked we didnt give up our higher rated prospects even though those guys did turn out to be good.
The guys at 1560 were throwing out ideas of what it would take for the Astros to even be considered. The most reasonable scenario they came up with was, Pence, Castro, and Bud Norris. This is the best the Astros can offer and it still might not be enough.
None of this statement works. It's not about "Uncle D biting the bullet" because we don't have the pieces to make the move. It wouldn't deplete the farm system because there isn't much of a system to deplete. But that's the same reason that it won't happen. You can lean all you want, but short of offering up Pence + Castro + something, I don't see how it would work. And I don't think anyone's up for taking Pence off the team at this point.
Eh, that was pretty hypothetical...I don't think anyone is going to offer anyone as ready to go as Hunter Pence. Ultimately, I don't think it will take that much for a team to get Halladay.
maybe...but I'm not sure the offer you're talking about there is better than the Guillen, Halama, Garcia package we offered in 98.
Biting the Bullet to me means having to take another 14 million in salary for two more years so roughly about 21 million more in total.
If they do it, they gotta lock him up long term. I'm not a fan of selling the farm for a rental. The Astros have been burned a couple times doing that.
I understand. I'm saying it doesn't even come into play (and I think if it was possible, he'd have no qualms about doing it--he's always done it before when it has put the team in contention, and Halladay certainly would).. but clearly it won't come into play b/c the pieces just aren't here
This article on ESPN brings up an interesting thought... I'm a big Cliff Lee fan. He's relatively cheap for a Cy Young winner ($6 mil this year, club option for $9 mil in 2010). They'd still have to give up a good portion of prospects to get him as Cleveland is probably slipping in to rebuild mode. I'm not saying it's entirely worth it. The Astros are an old team and there is no way you rely on Mike Hampton, Russ Ortiz, and Brian Moehler anywhere beyond this season. You have to be ready to plug in some youth next year and giving up Castro and/or Norris in a deal could be devastating long term. I'm also not sold that 1 starting pitcher makes that big of a difference in this team. I'd actually prefer they make a run at Scott Rolen. He's having a great season and Toronto is looking to dump salary. I think he'd make a bigger impact than any one pitcher would...and could probably cost less to get.
I would do it for Norris, Castro and Bogusevic. I wouldn't trade Pence and I'd be more reluctant to trade Jordan Lyles. With his velocity and K/IP, I think he'll be a stud pitcher.
Oh no dont get me wrong I agree with your premise...just not enough talent to out bid the Phillies and Dodgers but still I think IF the planets align prefectly and IF we make a play for him I think money will be an issue especially in today's economy.
They might. Norris has had a heck of a year and is a good young pitcher. Castro is a #1 draft pick and Bogusevic has showed really good promise after converting to the OF. I have no idea what the Jays might be able to get from another team.
From what I am reading Castro is a legitimate Mlb catcher. I don't know, after years of Ausmus and now Pudge it'd be nice to have an above average catcher for once.
