Is MJ not the GOAT because The Beatles have more record sales? Is MJ not the GOAT because Elvis was the original? Is MJ not the GOAT because high school kids can now do flips and crazy dance moves? Is the Weeknd better than MJ because he is of the moment and MJ is of the past? When did the goal post move? I don't remember literally ANYONE talking about Kareem as the GOAT in the late 80s into the 90s. Especially not any kids. All i remember before MJ was MJ, more commonly referred to as MAGIC on the same team as Kareem and outshining Kareem every way. I heard more about Bird than Kareem. I don't remember the league struggling when Kareem retired, do you? The world saw MJ vs MJ and Kareem never mattered again. When did so many get scared off from just saying MJ is the GOAT and there are no comparisons? You even got Pat Riley now saying Kareem was always his GOAT, but he wasn't singing that tune when Jordan retired and he retired MJ's number with the Heat and wanted the entire NBA to retire his number. MJ's, not Kareems. Ever since LeBron had this record in sight, you heard more and more about Kareem might actually be the GOAT. Who started that narrative? With decades in between without a whisper for Kareem? The only times you heard about Kareem was his pettiness toward Shaq, and even Shaq surpassed and shut him up with sheer dominance the world hadn't seen since Wilt, who Kareem also feuded with. Who would bring him to the forefront of the GOAT conversation? Someone who would benefit from surpassing his record, maybe? You hear more and more about the NBA's greatest unbreakable record(Those diehard fans will tell you it's SPORTS greatest record now). Really? It was celebrated in the moment just as someone scoring 81 points in front of Hollywood's biggest stars or as much as Kobe's crazy high scoring final game ever or as much as Stocktons assists and steals records were celebrated in front of the home crowd both times. We celebrated Hakeem blocks lead. Are Hakeem and Stockton's records not unbreakable and likely stand to longer than Kareems points record? Who actually believed Stocktons unbreakable records and longevity made him better than Magic outside of inbred Utah fans? Who actually believed Kareem was a better scorer than Wilt peak for peak? This record, the one with Karl Malone currently at 3, but long held #2, this list with Dirk at 6, Melo at 11 and Dan Issel at 12 is the definitive reason? Was Kobe going to be the GOAT if he never got injured at 34? Because i don't think there's a person who doubts he would have eventually surpassed Kareem too. Tell me what this list looks like in 30 more years, especially with this pace and offensive focus. When LeBron is surpassed by Luka in less time, is Luka the new GOAT? When Trae Yong passes Kobe and MJ, is he the better scorer? NONE of those records truly mattered outside of their moment when the GOAT was dominating and wowing and inspiring the world. If i witness with my own eyes, a guy come in and blow away the world and do more in less time than either MJ and he suddenly retires or dies, i will crown him and you will crown him and the people will have chosen. He wouldn't need 10 or 20 more years of stats or albums and crown himself. Congratulations LeBron James. It is impressive just as it was for Kareem and Karl Malone. Maybe Karl could have broke it if he stayed in Utah and didn't ring chase in LA and we could have called that piece of filth the GOAT. Those Utah fans and that team would have done anything in their power to make it happen and you could have proven it's just not that important of a record. Impressive. As impressive as Stockton's unbreakable assists and steals record and longevity. The moment should be celebrated as any other, but the moment will pass, as it did for Kareem. Longevity earns respect, but it doesn't take the heart. Let those who never witnessed the greatest believe he was just 'Invincible' MJ because most people only look at the end, and as time goes by they realize even that version of MJ was unbreakably the GOAT. "You can't believe it, you can't conceive it And you can't touch me, 'cause I'm untouchable And I know you hate it, and you can't take it You'll never break me, 'cause I'm unbreakable" Nothing got better. It's not getting better. We peaked a long time ago.
That Lakers game final score:. OKC: 133 LAL: 130 Lebron got his individual record. But wasnt 'goat' enough to get his team the actual win.
If I was starting a team, Magic would be the first player I would choose, over everyone else. That said, I consider MJ the Man w/Dream & Kareem right there.
I would take MJ every time. He was a culture changer in regards to turning it into a place that you had to give 100% or you were bullied off the team. He made everyone better, and even though guys didn't like him while playing with him. They all mentioned he made them better which says all you need to know.
He is the still the GOAT. And Hakeem is still closer to Lebron than most fair weather out there think.
MJ had the best killer instinct of them all. That thing is born with and you can't learn it Lebron is the best friendly player.
I get it. And, I absolutely agree with everything you said. But, Magic had a similar will to win. (he won a NCAA Title, followed by a NBA Title playing all positions as a rookie) Don't discount the importance of him being a coach on the court either. A 6'9" pure PG...coast to coast moves that ended in throwdowns. Those no look passes. Ahh, I miss those Saturdays watching LA vs Boston. He was the engiine of Showtime. And, IT was awesome. Of course they had to deal with the Boston dynasty every year. Still, 5 Titles. Only twice in the eighties did a team other than the Lakers get out of the West. Anyway, I've always thought Magc to be historically underrated.
Best 10 active season peak stretches for PER: Michael Jordan (86-97, 748 games): 29.8 LeBron James (07-17, 745 games): 29.2 Shaquille O'neal (93-03, 661 games): 29.1 Wilt Chamberlain (59-69, 787 games): 28.1 David Robinson (89-99, 685 games): 27.7 Kareem Abdul Jabbar (70-80, 773 games): 27.3 Kevin Durant (09-19, 695 games): 26.7 May have missed someone, but I think that would be the top 7. Of course, PER has its detractors (I'm sure people are rolling their eyes at David Robinson's position), but I think it's a reasonably good metric for era-adjusted stat comparisons.
I don't get all the GOAT talk. Just put them both on a pedestal. Co-MVPs, Co-GOATs. Sharing is caring. Lmao. I am a Jordan fan. The small advantage I think MJ has over LBJ I don't really want to care about.
Lol but it's true I am tired of this.. LBJ is clearly the better team player and Jordan is the better individual in their primes. Thing is basketball is a team game. What do you do？ Does an individual award matter so much in a team sport?
The joke about this is Lebron is a Scottie Pippen with half of MJ genes. And Jordan's son was kissing Larsa Pippen.
