If Bolton testimony is blocked, our democracy has ended.

How many times does he get to make to use the "rookie mistake" defense and you being ok with a it (as it appears anyway)?

Shouldn't we be outraged?

What kind of values to we stand for these days?

I remember asking this of Bobby the Great once?

Blagojevich went to prison for trying to sell a Senate seat.

Here, POTUS is using his power to get an upper leg on a rival.

It's obvious abuse of power to exchange my tax money to trump up bad press unto my presidential candidate.

WTF

 

Honestly don't get why a Republican would vote to allow witnesses. Witnesses only serve to draw this thing out, deepen the embarrassment for the President, and reduce his chance of re-election. Maybe they want to see him defeated in the election but want to avoid being politically tarred for voting to remove him. But, it'll deepen a Senator's own embarrassment to hear all the testimony and still vote to acquit. Maybe they think they can weather the storm, but I wouldn't even go down that road. Likewise for the Trump-country Democrats like Manchin. This impeachment vote will probably cost him his job no matter what, but I doubt a vote to make it longer and more sensational is going to even push in the right direction for him.

 

You might want to review the Supreme Courts ruling on Nixon.

 

Why would they be interested in calling the whistle blower?

 

politically, I think it’s safer for GOP senators to vote for witness. They will still acquit and said we heard and nothing changed- they can even said sure, it’s wrong but it does not raise to the level of impeachment. They may get a hit now but it will die out somewhat over time.

On the other hand, if they block, they will be attacked for covering up. And it’s almost certain that new info will continue to come out. The political hit is now, tomorrow, all the way to Election Day as long as new info keeps rolling out.

however, if they vote for witness, their head will be put on a spike.

Lose lose situation


There is an easy way out of all of this headache - do the right thing

 

Amazing how this argument ("can't have new witnesses" "if the House wanted more witnesses, they should have called them" "senate shouldn't have to do House's job") is simply not supported by the facts nor history...

NEW ANALYSIS: EVERY IMPEACHMENT TRIAL HAS HAD NEW WITNESSES

https://www.citizensforethics.org/press-release/new-witnesses-impeachment/
full analysis: https://s3.amazonaws.com/storage.ci...2020/01/28171243/Impeachment-New-Wit-Full.pdf

 

What Cracker Jacks decoder ring can figure of the logic in this retrumplican's excuse...

 

One thing I don't like about this post-truth era is that the arguments from one side are so sloppy and boring.

"You can't have new witnesses!" is just the lastest example. It's like watching a not-funny version of Idiocracy.

(trigger warning: language uncouth in modern times).

 

Come to think of it, I haven't heard about the whistle blower in a little while now. The threat has been to call Joe and/or Hunter Biden to testify. Did they decide chasing the whistleblower wasn't polling well?

 

From all I have read Trump does not have the power to postpone the inauguration and its my understanding that once the votes are counted he has no recourse to stay in power.

Can you please show me where I am wrong?

I think this whole Trump ignoring the results of the election are overblown.

 

I think they're still smart, if cynical. And they make public statements to talk with their primary voters in their home states. So, the disconnect is more just a sad statement on our society's decreasing ability to talk about facts. But if you point that out, it makes you an elitist of course. It just seems hardwired to get worse, but I don't want to think that way.

 

Well, here's where I think the dystopian possibility exists, (and I'm talking completely out of my ass).

1. Let's say Trump loses the electoral college but narrowly in a couple of key states. (This is very possible and I think the map will look a lot like in 2016 and he could win also.) But let's say he loses but via a few midwestern states that he only lost by thousands or tens of thousands of votes.

2. He then goes full board on "voter fraud" and "rigged" liberal districts and "dead people" voting, etc. He and FOX already have a bunch of right-wing people completely fired up about this largely nonexistent threat.

3. It ends there if the other branches of government are functioning. See the worry now? McConnell has shown himself to value power above all else, definitely above principle and the normal rule of law. He could marshal forces demanding recounts or fake investigations into liberal midwestern cities to have votes disqualified, etc. FOX never announces an official winner, pending recounts and court challenges, etc.

That all sounds crazy-pants, but it was more crazy-pants in the 20th century than the 21st. I'm just trying to offer you a glimpse of why people are nervous. Because, if Trump loses, steps 1&2 are completely guaranteed. That's just who he is. So then it's up to #3.

 

I looked into that scenario and I have yet to see where McConnell has the power to do anything to keep him in office.

If its contested then Pelosi would be president until everything is worked out.

Trump does not get to automatically stay in office under this scenario.

 

Good, I hope this is correct. It would/will be bumpy in any case, as Trump will contest things. I suppose states hold a lot of power in certifying their electoral college votes. We could see some monkey business as the state level, but let's hope not. Let's hope, whatever happens, it's as smooth as possible.

 

We have a precedent for this happening, in Bush v. Gore in 2000. In that case, it was up to Florida election officials initially to figure out who won the state. And then the SCOTUS stepping in on Equal Protection grounds. It was decided by December 12 to stay ahead of the Dec 18 meeting of the electors. Maybe allegations of voter fraud make the whole thing more complicated, but the whole citizenry is going to expect this precedent to be followed and to rapidly resolve any dispute.

 

So... trump's white house is is attempting to prevent bolton's book from being published... it must be really bad for trump's impeachment chances...

 

I hope we get to see the things Trump will say and do on Nov 3 if he were to lose the election. Twitter might melt on that day.