I don't think that's the important question here. Villone's had a superb year up until now, Benson has not. It's not like Benson is a Randy Johnson type of pitcher, he's not. His career to date would not warrant removing a 2003 Villone from our rotation. Now, if Villone reverts to old form, maybe you replace him with Benson if the others in the starting rotation don't warrant removal either. I doubt you could find a manager who would replace a 2003 Villone with a 2003 Benson, the past (even though that .7 run difference in ERA isn't that impressive) be damned.
That would be a big mistake....Ensberg is going to be huge....if they trade him it would be like Boston trading Bagwell. I sure hope Hunsiker is smarter then that. DD
you don't take a pitcher out of the starting rotation based on what could happen 2 months from now. If he's pitching great you keep him in the rotation. Kris Benson is overrated. He's never lived up to his potential and probably never will. To be honest i'm happy with the astros team as it is. All along i knew if we could play decent in the first half the team could take off in the 2nd half. And here we are... if we are able to get a guy like Sidney Ponson (Highly Unlikely) for a few minor leaguers i might do it but there isn't really anyone out there worth getting.
The only thing off the top of my head that I could think of is a Ensberg/Lane for Beltran trade. However, I can't see us benching Biggio, so I'm not sure what we'd do with him.
I thought Ensberg was gonna suck but he has shown he can hit. Why the heck would they try to trade Ensberg. It just doesn't make any sense. 1. He's not 21 but he's still young. 2. He has a very low salary. 3. We don't have a 3B Superstar prospect ready to step in. Ensberg is almost the equivalent of. 4. Our SP is not that bad. Oswalt, Miller are solid 1,2. Jeroime Robertson isn't bad. Redding can become a very good pitcher. Rosario showed he has all th tools to be a legitimate starter and Caros Hernandez can still come back next year. Plus we still have a few prospects in Triple AAA. Unless we get an everday left handed hitter with a good salary and potential superstar skills, the trade would suck.
The astros aren't trading Ensberg. Someone just threw that out there because they like Kris Benson. Ensberg is making the league minimum and he's one of the best 3rd baseman in baseball. He's not going anywhere. by the way, Peter Gammons said at the beginning of last year Morgan Ensberg had the ability to hit 30 to 35 home runs a year and he's definitely showing it.
i don't know what players are out there or who hunsicker might be looking at, but WTF would we trade morgan ensberg at the rate he's going. he looks legit. i know we've been playing the reds but i'm very happy with how this team looks and wouldn't be mad should they not make a move. don't make a trade just to make a trade.
some guy just threw Ensberg out there for no apparent reason. Maybe he's been reading the ESPN board a little too much.
Trade Ensberg? More craziness . You only trade a player at a position where you have depth of comparable quality. Geoff Blum does not constitute comparable quality . BTW, I think I rate Benson higher than most here. IMO, we'd be getting a reasonably priced player who can be expected to post an above-average ERA. That's enough for me from a 5th starter. Villone, who is a below-average career starter and has duration problems, is not. Oh well. I understand the idea of riding the hot hand, even if I disagree.
BTW. What has happened to Wilfredo Rodriguez. Baseball America continually ranked him among one of the Top 10 Astros prospects. I know he was hurt but what's the latest on him.
BTW, I think I rate Benson higher than most here. IMO, we'd be getting a reasonably priced player who can be expected to post an above-average ERA. I disagree. Benson hasn't been good by any stretch since his elbow surgery. He missed the 2001 season, last year posted an ERA of 4.7 and this year is at 5.0. Since the surgery, he's been nothing more than a mediocre to bad starter.
RM95: Hell yeah, it's a massive difference. Let's put it 2 differnet ways. .7 runs allowed per game is the difference (approximately) between being 2nd in pitching in the NL... and 9th. Put another way, if you had a pitching staff that allowed 4.97 runs per game, then it's going to allow 805 runs per year. If you have a pitching staff that allows 4.27, then about 692 runs per year. That's the difference between a team that's not competitive, and a team that is competitive. That's a huge difference. EDIT: Well, Major... that sort of is a catch. If you think he's going to recover, then you trade for him. If not, well, then you're right.
For an entire team, I agree. I just don't necessarily believe that it means has much when you're comparing two pitchers (only an extra 25 or so runs per year). I also don't think it's that massive a difference to determine that the one with a .7 run better career ERA should be starting over the one who currently has a 2.5 run better ERA. Also, just like Major pointed out, Benson hasn't been the same since elbow surgery.
RM95: But that's how teams are assembled, 1 player at a time! I mean, you can make arguments for Blum over Ensberg by saying "Well, it's only one position... Blum's a veteran who will help us out w/his grit and determination." Then you can say similar things w/regard to Benson and Villone. But if you think that way, then add it all up, you've got a mediocre team. Make each selection as if you're it's the future of the entire team, and I think you'll come out well in the end.
He hasn't been the same since he and his wife were in a certain adult publication. The Sports Illustrated jinx with nekid women.
That's all fine and dandy, but at this point, the only thing that Benson has a clear-cut advantage over Villone is his age. At this point, as we're attempting to make it to the playoffs this year, Villone stays in the rotation if we aquire any SP until his current level of play drops. A career .7 ERA advantage isn't a very strong argument against that, especially considering Benson's struggles after surgery.
A .7 ERA differential is a huge argument. The fact that we're in a playoff chase has nothing to do with it. Construct the team for which the prediction of future success is best. A .7 difference in ERA is massive, and it's going to add up over the course of a season. But I concede that the lack of success since the injury makes it dicey. TBH, I hadn't really thought too much about that. My excitement at the prospect of getting Benson was in a large part based on watching him pitch well a couple years ago.
This was reported on the cincinnati FOX outlet broadcast station friday I believe and was posed as an idea by the pittsburgh media. So desi did get from a credible source as I heard the same thing. I do like Kris Benson's makeup and I think he would be the best pitcher in this years trade class, but I wouldn't trade Ensberg for him. IMHO, the pirates won't even get close to that much for benson. Edit: I posted this rumor in a different thread, so JPM, sorry for overdefending my case.
