[ESPN] James Harden is the Sixth most clutch player

Feels like one of the threads that Mauri was advertising our young draft picks as 6th best talents of the draft.

It's always been 6th best here, 6th best there, what about Top 5 or Top 2?

 

Welp... I guess it comes down to what yer definition of "clutch" is...

I mean was Clutch City built upon how regular season games ended up... or was it about how players and a team responded when facing elimination in the most crucial games of the playoffs....

I guess it depends on when/where you place a greater priority... a regular season ending against a sub .500 Nuggets team... or idk... facing elimination in the WCF.....? lol

 

There's a difference between caring and then jumping to conclusions that Harden can't play basketball. I have np w/ good criticism as a fan but there's posters on this board that are crickets (no posts) when the team is winning and then come out in droves just to say how much the player/team sucks blah blah. You know who I'm talking about, it's likely over the years of disappointment some of us have become masochists and prefer the team to play badly, and if the team is playing good they're suddenly gone.

And yes, the Harden game sucked.

 

I find it curious no one is discussing Davis being top of a clutch list when his team doesn't make the playoffs

Davis being a skilled big is hard to stop when you need two points

Harden does a great job on a game to game basis of setting the pace for this team

Davis is consistent also but we definitely undervalue Harden's durability and game to game production

 

Although there are a couple jerkwads that relish a Rox defeat...I attribute what you're describing to 2 reasons...

1) People actually started to believe.... Longtime fans, such as myself, have learned to temper our expectations due to so many seasons that havent gone well... Well this season looked legit... Harden was having a phenomenal year getting everyone involved and sharing the ball.... Once Kawhi went out, I figured we were looking pretty good to advance... welp... not only did we not advance - we got humiliated - the reason for which, I would attribute due to our own teams/players dysfunction.... At that point, it's hard not to feel stupid for believing... nobody likes to feel stupid... so you're gonna get blow back on that front...

2) "Positive posters" - All season we've be inundated by the SOF's (stats only fans) ballyhooing Harden as the greatest thing since sliced bread.... This stat proves he's the best at this and this stat proves he's the greatest at that... "James harden just had the best season ever" "harden is better than Drexler..." "harden greatest offensive player..." "Is harden top 10 all time?" etc.... If any concerns or mention of any areas for improvement were put forth - posters were treated like red headed step children and just crushed by quotes of stats and records... Heck when i expressed concern over Harrell's diminished role, I got told "he's a scrub" and "doesnt deserve minutes..." "MDA knows what he's doin... look we got the #3 record..." There has been little opportunity to have a good dialog about areas of needed improvement - cause the fanboys were/are so head over heels.... Listening to a few months of that is enough to piss off the pope! lol
Heck, even in humiliating defeat without any real explanation, some are going on about how "we should be grateful..." and "harden just had a bad game - but he's our only opportunity to be contenders...blah blah blah..."

I, for one, would have loved nothing more than to see a Rockets championship this year... but after dealing with that rhetoric and watching it all fall apart in such dismal a fashion... I'm more pissed off than a one legged man at a butt kicking contest....

 

i dont get the comparison to carmelo anthony. carmelo is a forward, and dont have the playmaking skills that harden have. he only reason i can off that many posters compae harden to lin, is how their talent forced their organization to choose the better player and dump the scrub lin, and their fans have hated melo and harden and view the 2 as equals

harden is an atg, melo is not

 

We are supposed to ignore the stats when it comes to harden, but when lin scores 22 point and has 7 assist the world must stop

 

I'm glad that Harden is clutch in meaningless regular season games against non-Playoff teams like the Nuggets, but I need to see it in the PLAYOFFS against ELITE DEFENSES.

 

teams/players rarely hit gamewinning shots in the playoffs

but if you wanna see him hit clutch shots in the playoffs

 

Playmaking isn't limited to creating for others. It can also be used in reference to a player creating for himself. In Carmelo's prime, he was considered a selfish player who plateaued relatively early in his career and didn't seem to care about winning. That's probably where the Harden/Carmelo comparison comes from.

 

I dgaf about Lin... why r people still bringin that dude up? i get crap for referencing D12 and that was just the previous year...

What I'm sayin is stats are a tool in the evaluation process - not the final conclusion.... all season long any concerns that were raised (rotations, turnovers, attitude, need for another big, etc...) the replies were basically - 'your concern is stupid - we have the 3 rd best record in the league and look at these stats...'

...well those chickens came home to roost...

 

How is Harden is a selfish player but finishes in the top 15 assists, and top 10 guards every year. Melo never did that. your basketball knowledge is weak man

bbref compares hardens first 7 years in the nba to curry, nash, paul, and magic johnson, and this was before he made the full-time move to pg.. melo and harden are NOT comparable players

 

the spurs had more talent than us, so did the rest of the teams remaining in the playoffs. when morey stops drafting and keep the tyler ennis over the beasleys, and drafting nanu's.. maybe we will have a bench like and depth like the spurs

 

Westbrook is the presumed MVP this year and finished #3 in assists. Isn't he widely considered to be a selfish player? A player can have gaudy stats but still be considered selfish.

Harden has been our point guard since he joined the Rockets. And bbref makes comparisons based on stats, not style of play. Harden's overall game is closer to Carmelo Anthony's than it is Magic's, Curry's, or Paul's.

 

the Spurs prob had more talent roster wide... but I think without Kawhi and TP we had more talent in a 6 man rotation... which MDA didnt go much deeper than that - lol... Trez shoulda got some time - imo...
It's been my view that this team wasn't intended to really contend this last year... it was supposed to be more of a 'get a system in place... everyone get acclimated to each other...see if any of the youngsters got anything....etc...' year. My expectation was next year the bench would have fewer projects and more Jason Terry type players - vets on the downhill that could still give you a few solid minutes a night as needed...

and yea, I thought ditchin Beas was a stupid move.. cheap contract and coulda been an occasional offensive spark plug... i got a feelin ditchin guys like Beas and, KJ was more of a 'players all getting along thing'... but i could be wrong...

 

I love the argument that Harden obviously isn't selfish because he gets tons of assists... harden was #1 in assists last year... but Westbrick was #3... so fwiw... lol

like I said earlier... stats are a tool - not the final conclusion...

 

I dun call players selfish. I think this generation of players are more self aware, aware of stats than the past generation.

 

I was at that Spurs game - loved Harden from that moment on and I was there routing for the Spurs.

Also noting that it's a lot harder to stop one player when you have Westbrook, Durant, and Ibaka also on the roster. The moral of the story is, playoff game winners are difficult in general and they are especially difficult if you don't have multiple stars on your team. Robert Horry and Ray Allen aren't hitting tons of playoff game winners if they don't have the benefit of playing along side Shaq & Kobe, Tony, Timmy, & Manu, Lebron, Wade, and Bosh, KG, Paul Pierce, etc. Expecting Harden to do the same in the playoffs with less help is absurd and underscores the fact we need a 2nd star on this team in the worst kind of way.

 

6th most Clutch Player

2nd most Clutch quitter

 

everything we know about harden and his draft comparable markelle fults is still going numero uno over jsh jackson( who is compared to kawhi), and johnathan issac( who is comp

go root for another team then, harden is gonna retire a rockets and most likely play all 82.. who cares that the media hates the guy and wont give him his mvp.. not his fault he came out the way he did