Im glad some soldiers really take the work that they do to the heart. But for some soldier, who is already pre "programmed" with what his position in the war is, its kinda hard for him to have an unbiased view. It is also True that there are many soldiers who come back and say that they have done much more negative than positive in this war either way, thanks for the email.. ill try to get one of my friends who was disabled in the war to join this site. And listen to his point of view...
Yes, the gentleman currently is in South Carolina...I get that. However, Reggie was stating that the gentleman was over in Iraq putting his azz on the line while others among us were on internet message boards infuriating others with their opinions on such important topics such as Shakira and Narnia. Sam, for an ex-lawyer I would expect you to understand this point better. Your clients deserve better comprehension that what you have displayed here.
I'm glad we agree. For the record, other posters played the "he's over in Iraq" card (which as you agree, he was not at the time of writing) therefore I brought it up. This is all of course with the caveat that the email is genuine - it sounds a bit like a form letter drawn up by the DoD to me, which I believe they've done before.
True, but maybe reggie's friend is a sissy coward like Kerry was in Vietnam and maybe Sam's a badass like Bush.
jeez. Some people... I just found this thread. Some of you bitter people just need to go away. Just fly away. It is so frustrating to read your ignorance and skepticism. You believe with all of your heart some of the things you post and that is so damned sad. Keyboard gangstas...making so little difference in the world other than spreading a disease of discontent. BTW - I have changed my view on GW. I think he is weak and fiscally irresponsible. I am not a goosestepping, Hannitized fool. I am not a republican. I am, however, conservative in my views.
Maybe it's some of the other threads reggietodd has started (milk terrorists) that raise suspicions around here or perhaps the writing style seems a bit odd to some... ______________ It is. It is, indeed. I say to you, as my fellow countrymen, that all of our efforts and sacrifice over there, are for the better of the world and for the security of our great country. The situation is not perfect. But, it is so much better than the media reports. We must stay the course and see this thing through. Who writes to their family and friends like this? My fellow countrymen... Sounds like it was taken verbatim from a Bush/ Cheney war rally speech. ______________________ I really don’t want to comment on the validity ~ just throwing this out there for discussion.
yeah.. going back to the milk "terrorists" i figured out that they might have owned a convenience store and ran out of milk that's why they decided to buy a lot of milk.. yeah sounds like a bush speech alright if Iraqi insurgents were really "evil" from the day they were born, so Saddam was right in trying to discipline them.. so why are we there? why do we care about "animals"? is it because these "animals" happen to be sitting on OIL?
We fight wars to preserve peace: sounds very hypocritical, doen't it? Well, regardless of how ironic that sounds, our country is fighting for whatever means. A letter such as this one only shows that some of these soldiers really believe in what they fight for. Are they practically brainwashed to believe that?... to an extent, probably, but it still doesn't do any good to discredit or disrespect them in any way. I support the soldiers, just not the war as much. Although I didn't like the war, mainly because there are so many political views aside from the "fight for freedom, beat the terrorists" in this war, which we'd almost have to believe at this point, there are still injustices going on. Everything's political when it comes to war. Why are we invading Iraq, who has denied making any weapons, but let N. Korea be while they're practically raising their hands in elementary schoolkids fashion saying: "We've got them!!!! Iraq has economical gains as a possibility and declaring war on NK would probably destroy SK. But I digress. My point is: there are so many things we know or not know. Personally, I doubt that the DoD is making these letters to gain support for the war seems a little overbearing. Whether they are trained to think that way or not, that's another debate. I just choose to support them while they're overseas and I wish for them the best. I find it simply silly to debate over a letter where the intent seems to be a simple "letter that ReggieTodd wanted to share because he thought it's inspirational."
Some of you have really outdid yourselves in this one. Brining up the old milk thread to try and prove this letter to not be legit? Telling me that one of my best friends is in North Carolina instead of Iraq? Don't you think I know that? The letter is legit. Period. So put that argument to rest. Also i'm sure there are soldiers out there who think the exact opposite of my friend. You know what? I don't know, because those soldiers didn't include me on an email. I'm just sharing what a friend wrote to me, something that shed some positive light on the situation in Iraq, something that the media would probably never report. I think Chance said it best. The fact that some of you actually believe some of the garbage you are saying is the saddest part of this whole situation.
I'm talking about a narrative as a relaying of a personal experience, not someone narrating a political ad. Not like hearsay at all, its a first hand account. While a narrative does give insight into the thinking of the author by relaying their experience, it also relays that experience. Its a commentary on why giving weight to a narrative can expose insight into a particular topic. My point is that if you are trying to conduct 'focused, organized thinking' about a topic then excluding the narrative as 'crap' is silly. Look, you can use hard data to answer the question 'did the GDP go up or down last year.' The answer is yes or no. But to answer the question 'did the quality of life go up or down last year' you have to interpret all kinds of data. Which variables you pick affects your outcome presumably. To form a conclusion without considering the personal narrative is not thinking critically. It is not logical to exclude a form of data just 'because...' Let's say you have a study that says 'the quality of life went up last year.' And you have 50 million narratives saying 'no doubt about it, our quality of life went down last year.' Do you automatically defer to the study because it has 'hard statistics' in it? I don't think that's a good example but it does illustrate my point so let's take a look. The narrative doesn't deny your statistic. You statistic doesn't disprove the narrative. It can be true that the soldier doesn't know anyone who has been killed, that we are doing fine in Iraq, and that 2,000 soldiers have been killed. The soldier, in your example, does not say the casualty rate is NOT at 2,000 dead. He/she says 'we're doing fine in Iraq.' In examining whether or not we are 'doing fine in Iraq' or not, and you want to do it in a logical manner, then you ought to include in your information narratives from people who are actually over there. Knowing that 2,000 soldiers have died does NOT tell you whether we are 'doing fine' or not. OTOH, let's say you have an opinion that the situation in Iraq is terrible. Then you have a narrative that says that isn't that person's experience. Do you disregard as 'crap' that narrative? Is that what a 'critical thinker' does? I do not believe so. I'm not saying you take a narrative as holy writ, there more than likely are contra-narratives. But neither do you dismiss it out of hand. A survey is just a bastardized bean counters accounting of narratives. And 'hard statistics' don't tell you whether 'its going well in Iraq' or not. That's my point. Whether its going well or not is by definition an opinion. Hence, the narrative is a legitimate way to explore what is happening. And I never said you would determine your opinion on 'one single story.' What if you have a thousand narratives, or a hundred thousand - would those be 'crap' just because they are relaying of personal experience? Azadre thinks so and you seem to be supporting his contention. I don't believe that is organized or logical thinking. I was talking about Azadre so don't get snippy. The quote supports my contention that the narrative is a legitimate way to gain insight on a topic so I'm not sure what your problem is. Actually why don't you clarify your point. Azadre's claim was that using personal experience to gain insight on a topic is 'crap.' I countered that there is great value in using the narrative to learn more about a topic (learning about a topic is, IMO, inherently necessary to think 'critically' about a topic). What is your point?
I find it amazing that the people here who continually bash our troops and doubt every good word that comes out... or say ignorant things like "since they are low ranking they don't know the true scope" have never even tried to join the military much less served, and I would go to be that no one close to them is currently serving. I just want to comment further on one of the most ignorant things I have ever read here, and I'm not even going to look back at who posted it... but the whole "I bet he is low ranking and doesn't know what it's like, blah blah blah..." Obviously you have never know anyone who has served in a war, or ANY high ranking military officials, because they will ALL tell you first hand that the ones to go to for the FULL STORY is the grunts. The Generals are making calls in air conditioning while the grunts ARE looking the enemies in the eyes. I would also encourage those who say the troops are "brain washed" and told how to view the enemy and how to form their opinions is even more ignorant. Today's military tells you nothing of how to view the fight or the war, they just tell you it is your job to do as you are told... make your decisions on your own. Trust me, there are always plenty of soldiers who doubt that their mission is worth it while they are there... think Korea, Vietnam and Somalia... the military does not brain wash them, so keep your conspiracy theories to your Al Franken news hours. The inner struggle of a soldier wondering if they are causing more harm then good is the main reason for a high suicide rate, and idiots half a world away pecking away on keyboards who take for granted the soldier's sacrifices just add to that inner struggle... you utopian wack-jobs should be proud.
I find it amazing that people like you continue to have such an extreme lack of class that you accuse others of not supporting the troops. As has been pointed out hundreds of times on this BBS, those who are anti-war support the troops, but not the leadership. The troops are valiant, brave heroes who put their lives on the line. The leadership has shown itself to be corrupt, manipulative, and dishonest. Stop spreading lies about people.
^^^ You are delusional if you think that there aren't people on this board that root for bad news out of Iraq, and openly trumpet it when it happens. We've seen threads about troops terrorizing Iraqis -- heck, we've seen John Kerry say it himself. We've seen countless threads about troops 'torturing' Iraqis. We've seen posters say that the troops have lost the war. There have been liberal posters defending anti-war protesters hounding visitors to military hospitals, housing injured troops. Story after story lately has discussed how the media is focusing primarily on bad news out of Iraq, and the troops are getting fed up with it. The liberals have been pouncing on this one-sided depiction of the action and have been undermining the support of the American public. In an interview this week, President Bush summed it up well. He said that the United States can not be defeated militarily. The only way for the terrorists to win is for the US to lose its nerve. Who is working towards that end? The liberals and the terrorists. Partners in crime. Time to open your eyes, moon.
Being troubled by factual events such as torture by U.S. troops in no equals the rooting against troops. what John Kerry commented on is from an official report from the Red Cross. Again nothing you mentioned in anyway is evidence of people rooting against the troops. If you think discussing some of the bad events that actually happened is not supporting troops then their is something wrong with your thinking. The only evidence showing that people on this board don't support the troops is your claims of what other people's motives are, with nothing to support your claims. Either provide evidence or stop making your sillly little accusations wtih zero supporting evidence. Your claims are baseless, and you have yet after asked time and time again provided one single shred of proof.
Of 16,000+ members on this board - perhaps 100 share this fringe repub view ~ the rest support freedom of speech (something we're fighting for in Iraq).
http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=104825 A thread where wnes slammed the troops for an accidental shooting, calling them “jumpy” and implying they were at fault http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=100907&highlight=hospital Liberals defending the taunting of injured US troops. http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=105546 Liberals defending John Kerry’s reckless lie that American troops are terrorizing Iraqis. This is a mere sampling, collected in roughly 1 minute of searching. It doesn’t even include the taunts from the left that the troops have lost the war, nor the accusations from the likes of Azadre, adeelsiddiqui, et al about how the troops aren’t doing any good deeds, nor the very damning fact that the liberals do not hesitate to smear the troops with negative stories but have rarely, if ever, posted any positive threads about the troops. Open your eyes.
