1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Carlos Hernandez update

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by Nick, Jul 19, 2004.

  1. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 1999
    Messages:
    48,124
    Likes Received:
    14,345
    Note... he never got hurt by throwing (or overthrowing)... he got hurt siding head-first into second base. I can understand not wanting to "rush" him, but I also understand that he's not going to accomplish much more at AAA now... and its important for him to start gaining confidence ASAP at the big league level again, so that the transition next year is that much smoother.

    Also, I tend to disagree with 89 not cutting it. 84-86 mph (which was Jeriome Robertson range) is definitely not going to do anything, but pitching at 89-90, as long as he's able to change speeds, and locate well, will be VERY effective.

    Also, his + curveball and change-up will make that pitch seem a LOT faster (see Daryle Kile). Also, and I can't stress this enough, an average lefty pitcher is just as valuable as an above-average righty pitcher.

    In the end, its all about the ability to control and locate... and he's been doing that with excellence the last month.

    If you want the perfect opposite of that, see Tim Redding... who throws 94-95, but doesn't locate nor change speeds well at all, and thus gets shelled... even though his "stuff" is much better than most no.5 pitchers out there.

    I guarantee you, with the way Redding has thrown this year, he wouldn't be matching Carlos' numbers at AAA.
     
    #21 Nick, Jul 24, 2004
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2004
  2. bigboymumu

    bigboymumu Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 1999
    Messages:
    3,421
    Likes Received:
    1
    Nick,
    I believe Hernandez can be a very good player in this league. All I am saying is... I don't want him to start throwing harder than he should be throwing. He has experience in the majors, I just would hate to see him get hurt again. If he does come up, I would keep a careful eye on him. Make sure he is not trying to throw too hard!
     
  3. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 1999
    Messages:
    48,124
    Likes Received:
    14,345
    Indeed... i'm sure they'd have him on a strict pitch count, and they'd be monitoring his mechanics like crazy. Of course, keeping him healthy is the #1 priority. (of course, if we were the Cubs, he would have been pitching for us even with his bum shoulder... they ruin arms like no other.)

    I just feel that the confidence that could be gained from some good starts to close out this year could prove invaluable to his performance for next year.

    And, if he gets pounded at the MLB level, it lets him know that as good as he was in AAA, he's gotta work harder in the offseason and winter-ball in getting that arm strength back, so he can get these MLB hitters out.

    Either way... as long as he doesn't get injured... he'll benefit.
     
  4. bigboymumu

    bigboymumu Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 1999
    Messages:
    3,421
    Likes Received:
    1
    I agree!
     
  5. RunninRaven

    RunninRaven Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2000
    Messages:
    15,022
    Likes Received:
    2,658
    Is the Zephyrs hitting coach the same Sean Berry that played 3rd base for the Astros during the mid 90s?
     
  6. leroy

    leroy Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2002
    Messages:
    26,371
    Likes Received:
    9,605
    Yes, he is. He was here in Round Rock until Gaetti got called up to the majors.


    I say that the big club should make 2 more moves. Bring up Springer and send Bullinger back down. Also, call Carlos up and put either Munro or Redding back in the pen (whomever does worse in their next start) and waive David Weathers. He is terrible and old, not a good combination.
     
  7. Fegwu

    Fegwu Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2002
    Messages:
    5,162
    Likes Received:
    4

    3 games within wild card leader board.
     
  8. codell

    codell Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2002
    Messages:
    19,312
    Likes Received:
    710
    I wanted to bring up Doug Davis in this thread, because he is a perfect example of how Carlos Hernandez can succeed with an 89 MPH fastball.

    :)
     
  9. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 1999
    Messages:
    48,124
    Likes Received:
    14,345
    At first I thought you were supporting the point... then I looked at the time of your post, and noticed the Astros put up a 4-spot, thus making it sarcasm... nice. :D

    But, all kidding aside, it doesn't matter if its 89mph or 94mph... if you throw the ball in the location that Davis was (right down the middle to Lamb, and not high enough to Ensberg), you're going to get pounded no matter what.

    Carlos can survive... he just has to locate well, and he can't make any mistakes. Also, Pupura said in today's chron that "the velocity is where we want it to be," indicating that if Munro or Redding falters, he'll probably be given his shot.
     
  10. codell

    codell Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2002
    Messages:
    19,312
    Likes Received:
    710
    Nick,

    Actuallly, i wasn't being sarcastic.

    Doug Davis has an ERA under 4 this year.
     
  11. RunninRaven

    RunninRaven Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2000
    Messages:
    15,022
    Likes Received:
    2,658
    Sweet! I loved Sean Berry back in the day. He rules.
     
  12. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 1999
    Messages:
    48,124
    Likes Received:
    14,345
    Ah... well I guess it was just one damn big coincidence that the time of your post perfectly aligned with the exact time the astros rocked Davis for 4 runs (in fact, they showed the clock at MMP, because they had that running contest with Garner and the 4 run inning).

    But yeah... Davis has been good all year primarily because of his ability to change speeds and locate well... two thing Carlos will HAVE to do.

    Also, Carlos has a much better changeup and curveball than Davis, giving all the more reason why he can be effective.

    Hell... Pettite's fastball only hovers around 90-91 right now (at its peak)... but then again, he's got the vicious cutter that neutralizes any batter.
     
  13. RunninRaven

    RunninRaven Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2000
    Messages:
    15,022
    Likes Received:
    2,658
    Shane Reynolds was a solid starter for years and he never got much faster than 90.

    Is he still pitching?
     
  14. codell

    codell Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2002
    Messages:
    19,312
    Likes Received:
    710
    Shane, at his best, was pitching in the 92-93 range. He became mediocre when he started hitting around 90.

    I think he made a start or two for Arizona this year and got whacked around pretty good.
     
  15. gunn

    gunn Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2003
    Messages:
    1,698
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm having a hard time realizing as to why Taveras has not been called up to New Orleans. He's tied for second in hits on the team, with 97, despite playing in 21 fewer games. He also currently boasts incredible numbers with a batting average of .344, an OBP of .406, and a SLG% of .397. To top that off he as stolen 41 bags with a stolen base % of 75.6. My guess as to why he hasn't been called up is to work on drawing walks or possibly to keep Round Rock competitive. His numbers should warrant a call-up. Some good games to keep and eye on Willy are on Tuesday, July 27 and August 7. In these two games Round Rock is scheduled against San Antonio (Mariners Texas League team) who in both games are slated to pitch 18 year old, phenom Felix Hernandez. In the only game they've faced each other Taveras has got the better of Hernandez in an individual matchup going 1-1 with a single, SB and a run scored, with a walk and a SAC bunt.

    Hernandez eventually got the win which was his first in AA since being called up.

    Here's the write up on Felix if you are interested:

    Felix Hernandez, rhp
    Age: 18 Ht.: 6-3 Wt.: 170 Bats: R Throws: R
    Signed: Venezuela, 2002
    Signed by: Pedro Avila


    Background: The Mariners expected Hernandez to be good when they signed him for $710,000, but not this good, this fast. Seattle is not inclined to challenge teenagers with an assignment to the short-season Northwest League, populated mostly by former college players, but when Hernandez threw in the mid-90s last spring, he punched his ticket to Everett. The youngest player in the NWL by nearly eight months, he was dominant despite being kept on tight pitch counts. He pitched scoreless ball in five of his 11 outings. He was an easy choice as the NWL’s No. 1 prospect. Promoted for the low Class A Midwest League stretch drive, he responded with two quality starts in as many tries. In the season finale, he shut out Kane County with 10 strikeouts in seven innings. Hernandez succeeded against even more experienced hitters this winter, going 1-1, 4.23 in six starts for Lara in his native Venezuela. The Mariners shut him down in December so he wouldn’t exceed 100 innings in 2003.

    Strengths: Hernandez has scary upside. He’ll open this season as a 17-year-old and he doesn’t need to develop any more stuff. The only guy in the organization with a comparable arm is big leaguer Rafael Soriano. Hernandez has the best fastball in the system and commands his mid-90s heat well. He regularly touches 97 and could reach triple digits as his skinny frame fills out. Hernandez’ curveball is also unparalleled among Mariners farmhands and gives him the possibility for two 70 pitches on the 20-80 scouting scale. Though he’s young and can easily overpower hitters at the lower levels, he understands the value of a changeup and is developing a good one. He can pitch down in the strike zone or blow the ball by hitters upstairs. He has poise and mound presence beyond his years.

    Weaknesses: Hernandez just has to learn how to pitch. He needs to tweak his command and refine his pitches. Typical of a teenager with a lightning arm, he’ll overthrow at times but should grow out of that. Arm problems would appear to be the only thing that could derail him from stardom, and Hernandez has been perfectly healthy so far. The Mariners will go to great lengths to make sure he isn’t overworked in the minors.

    The Future: Seattle wants to move Hernandez slowly, but he may not let that happen. He’s not going to need to spend a full season at each level and might need just two more years in the minors. He’ll probably start 2004 back at low Class A Wisconsin—the Mariners concede he could have spent all of last season there—and could be bucking for a promotion to high Class A Inland Empire by midseason. It’s easy to get overexcited about young pitchers, but Hernandez has the legitimate potential to become the best pitcher ever developed by the Mariners.

    EDIT: In 32 career games, Hernandez is now 17-5, 2.51 with 223 strikeouts in 179 innings while easily holding his own at Double-A. His K/9ip is 11.26 which is flat out amazing considering he just recently turned 18.
     
    #35 gunn, Jul 25, 2004
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2004

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now