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Robert Mueller, Former F.B.I. Director, Is Named Special Counsel for Russia Investigation

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by KingCheetah, May 17, 2017.

  1. No Worries

    No Worries Contributing Member

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    Trump's lawyers want him not to do interview with Mueller in Russia inquiry: NYT

    President Donald Trump's lawyers want him to refuse to be interviewed by Robert Mueller in the ongoing investigation involving Russia and other possible areas of criminal activity. He may refuse, but the investigation isn't going away.

    It's not surprising that Trump's lawyers probably believe he is so erratic and unhinged that he'll self-incriminate. But it's pretty shameful.

    “Lawyers for President Trump have advised him against sitting down for a wide-ranging interview with the special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III,” reports the New York Times, citing 'four people briefed on the matter.'

    What may be ahead: a “months long court battle over whether the president must answer questions under oath.”

     
    KingCheetah and FranchiseBlade like this.
  2. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    This approach has never occurred to me.

    Trump will not be allowing the release of the rebuttal memo without neutering it.

    Muddying the water is the point. Soon, Trump will refuse to be interviewed by Mueller. He will rely on this memo to make the case that the investigation is illegitimate. Democrats will howl, of course, but the people who want to believe him will justify themselves in doing so by either believing the memo or by saying that no one can know what to believe because everything is so confusing.
     
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  3. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    Robert Mueller Is No Ken Starr

    Comparing Mueller’s treatment with Starr’s shows the forgetfulness of Donald Trump’s critics.

    No matter the criticisms directed his way by Republicans, Robert Mueller should count himself lucky: He’s not Ken Starr. The punctilious, mild-mannered independent counsel appointed by a three-judge panel in the 1990s, Starr investigated all manner of Bill Clinton scandals, most spectacularly the Monica Lewinsky affair. A former D.C. circuit judge and U.S. solicitor general in the first Bush administration, he had struck no one prior to his appointment as a goose-stepping lieutenant in the sex police, or a partisan fanatic likely to be driven by sheer hatred to attempt to destroy a Democratic president. Starr became all of these things for Clinton’s defenders, who thought a good offense was the best defense of a president caught lying under oath.

    A former Clinton adviser said Starr’s investigation “smacks of Gestapo” and “outstrips McCarthyism.” The estimable historian Garry Wills mused that it shouldn’t be Bill Clinton, but Ken Starr who should be impeached. Anthony Lewis, a liberal lion at the New York Times, opined that Starr’s “abuses were driven by an obsessive — and, for a prosecutor, entirely inappropriate — determination to force President Clinton from office by any means available.”

    On and on it went. It was trench warfare over Starr’s every move. In a signature piece of writing during the Lewinsky scandal, New York Times columnist Maureen Dowd managed to portray Starr, not Bill Clinton, as the sex-obsessed goat, even though the former judge wasn’t the one chasing interns around his desk. This history is relevant because it shows the forgetfulness of Donald Trump’s critics, who seem to believe that it’s unprecedented for a special counsel to attract the ire of a president’s defenders. In an often abnormal time, the most normal thing that’s happened over the past six months is that attitudes toward the Mueller investigation have broken down along partisan lines.

    Robert Mueller may be motivated by a disinterested pursuit of the truth (tempered, one hopes, by an appropriate sense of limits), but his most ardent fans are rooting for any criminal infraction that, in their fevered dreams, will lead to President Trump’s getting frog-marched from the White House. The persistent fantasy that Trump can somehow be leveraged from office is behind the push to criminalize any blameworthy conduct on his part or that of his associates.

    It wasn’t just bad form in pursuit of a foolish policy for incoming national-security adviser Michael Flynn to talk to Russian ambassador Sergey Kislyak about sanctions; it was a violation of the Logan Act. Don Jr.’s notorious meeting with Russians wasn’t just amateurish and ill-considered; it was a violation of a law against taking an in-kind contribution from a foreign national. The continued operation of Trump businesses isn’t just unseemly; it’s a violation of the “Emoluments Clause.” Trump’s withdrawn directive to fire Mueller wasn’t merely a potentially catastrophic decision that he got talked out of; it was evidence of obstruction of justice. Very little can’t be made to fit under this rubric.

    In his rebuttal to the Nunes memo, New York Democrat Jerry Nadler alleged that the document made Republicans an accessory to a crime — “part and parcel” of Trump’s effort “to obstruct the Special Counsel’s investigation.” Even in the worst case for Trump, Mueller is unlikely to charge him with a crime. There is longstanding Office of Legal Counsel guidance that it’s unconstitutional to indict a president while he’s in office. The worst case for Trump is probably a report by Mueller that could become, in effect, an impeachment referral.

    Much will depend on the facts; on whether Mueller is willing to stand aside if he doesn’t find anything to justify his continued investigation; and who wins Congress this year and, if it’s the Democrats, by how much. But there can be little doubt that, in their hearts, most Democrats have decided for impeachment. The fighting now may be mere skirmishing compared with the larger political war to come.

    Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/artic...ert-mueller-kenneth-starr-got-worse-treatment
     
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  4. adoo

    adoo Member

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    the dizzying height of intellectual dishonesty; the National Review pretends that these developments have not happened,

    in less than 6 months, mueller has already issued 4 indictments, w 2 guilty pleads, w a third one (Gates) in the works​
     
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  5. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    I don't want just any infraction. Perjury or simple obstruction would be a bit insufficient. He'd have to find money laundering or conspiracy for me to be satisfied. The ardent fans being referenced here must be somebody else, but I feel like I'm getting painted with the same brush.

    So, I'm supposed to believe that contradicting and undermining the foreign policy of the sitting president is simply bad form? That seeking the cooperation of foreign spies to win an election is just amateurish? That receiving significant financial benefits from power players around the globe that do so with the intention of influencing the president's policy is just unseemly? I think in their urgings that I not over-react to the news, they completely under-react. There are reasons we have the Logan Act, the Emoluments Clause, and laws against conspiracy. Sober-minded writing doesn't really camouflage that National Review is still just rationalizing Trump.
     
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  6. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    BOB MUELLER’S INVESTIGATION IS LARGER—AND FURTHER ALONG—THAN YOU THINK
    https://www.wired.com/story/bob-muellers-investigation-is-largerand-further-alongthan-you-think/
     
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  7. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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  8. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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  9. Aceshigh7

    Aceshigh7 Contributing Member

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    Unless I’m wrong, there’s no requirement to disclose gifts given if not claiming a deduction for that gift. It’s incumbent on the gift recipient to report that on their taxes.
     
  10. larsv8

    larsv8 Contributing Member

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    He might have deducted it as a business expense or loss.

    And thats not what a gift is.
     
  11. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    Mariotti is a lawyer (and candidate for IL Attorney General). And he was referring to Cohen's tax return. You do have to file a form 709 for large financial gifts and even pay taxes if they exceed $14k I believe. I also think you have to show it was a gift, not a loan nor a payment for something.
     
  12. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    I guess the next question... how many other women did Cohen pay off out of his own pocket for trump? Bannon estimated there were maybe a hundred women on the campaign trail (in Fire and Fury) that Cohen had to pay off.
     
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  13. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    A $130,000 'gift'... good luck with that.
     
  14. Rashmon

    Rashmon Contributing Member

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    The incredible levels of deceit, corruptness, and ineptitude that supporters of this Dullard-in-Chief are willing to condone, accept, and justify is just stunning.
     
  15. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"

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    To me, it's a lot more disappointing as an American than Trump himself or his election. It's the water carriers that make me think less of this land. We knew Trump. We knew people were desperate to vote for change, (and yes, we knew there some desperate racists thrown in as well), but I didn't know some of the otherwise decent, at one time self-respecting Republicans could mutate into creatures who would do and say what they're doing for this horrible, rudderless, narcissist. It's not at all necessary to achieve their policies. But there it is: literally support or vouch for anyone saying anything and doing anything as long as they are not a democrat. Not a very good recipe for a sane outcome.
     
  16. pirc1

    pirc1 Contributing Member

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    GOP have always been hypocrites for the most part, their party principles currently are based on hypocrisy.
     
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  17. peleincubus

    peleincubus Member

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    I could not have said this any better. It's exactly my thoughts articulated.

    I would like to throw in the fact that people out there tried to justify voting for Clinton because of their disdain for Trump is not good enough. She was an awful candidate (as has been stated by many intelligent people here)
     
  18. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    These are dark times. The degree with which we're seeing sacred institutions attacked - the FBI, the CIA, the Justice Department, the State Department, the Judicial system - not to mention the attack on the press - is disturbing. And the fact that most Republicans now trust Putin more than our own intelligence agencies is forbearing.

    Could this be how America falls from Superpower status? Russia lost the cold war but one the information one. And China leap frogs to the new leader of the free world.
     
  19. Buck Turgidson

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    Ouch. That truth actually hurts a bit, not me really, but the people I know.

    It makes me sad.
     
  20. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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