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Jan Vesely in trade talks

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by Carl Herrera, Jun 25, 2013.

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Haymitch Custom Title

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Rocket Booster said: ↑

If you are going to say that at least have the decency to state that I NEVER said anything about Vesely being better than Griffin.

That's a complete damn lie from kevC
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I never endorsed kevC's claim, as I had no idea if it was true or not. I just answered another poster's question.

#21 Haymitch, Jun 25, 2013

da_juice Member

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A poor man's Bargnani, with less of a shooting stroke.

AKA Garbage

#22 da_juice, Jun 25, 2013
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Rocket Booster said: ↑

If you are going to say that at least have the decency to state that I NEVER said anything about Vesely being better than Griffin.

That's a complete damn lie from kevC
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You are OHMSS?

#23 arno_ed, Jun 25, 2013
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DO NOT WANT!

#24 Chamillionaire, Jun 25, 2013
baller4life315 Member

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basketballholic said: ↑

Very, very low. He is in danger of being out of the league if he can't rectify his free throw shooting issues. He simply can't get court minutes shooting freebies in the 30s. Too easy to defend.
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Not to mention, he has no actual ball skills whatsoever.

It's basically 4-on-5 basketball whenever he's out there.

#25 baller4life315, Jun 25, 2013
baller4life315 Member

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da_juice said: ↑

A poor man's Bargnani, with less of a shooting stroke.

AKA Garbage
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Nah, more like AK47 with no jumper or offensive skills to speak of.

Basically, as somebody already suggested, another Joe Alexander.

#26 baller4life315, Jun 25, 2013
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Carl Herrera said: ↑

He's only 23, very athletic, was a 6th overall pick not long ago and spent time with a dumb team who doesn't know how to develop guys. Too soon to call him a bust?
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#27 SC1211, Jun 25, 2013

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Carl Herrera said: ↑

He's only 23, very athletic, was a 6th overall pick not long ago and spent time with a dumb team who doesn't know how to develop guys. Too soon to call him a bust?
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well ...since he's two years into his career instead of just one; and hasn't proven he can play very well, i think we are inching towards the bust tag.

I live in DC and have been to several Wiz games (yes, that's pretty sad), and i can honestly say that this guy is a ways away from being a decent player in this league.

TRob is actually already better

#28 Aruba77, Jun 25, 2013
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Is his kissing GF going to be traded with him?

#29 daywalker02, Jun 25, 2013
kevC Member

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OHMSS said:

Vesely can do any dunk Griffin does in an NBA game, as well, or better, except for the power aspect. But he can get off the floor quicker. In the wide open, almost zero defense regular season NBA, he will be an automatic dunk highlight reel if he is used properly.

He is used to playing in a league with a smaller court, hand-checking, a true zone allowed, no defensive 3 seconds rule, very physical play (much more than the NBA is), very lenient refs, and where most teams just plant 2 6-10 to 7-0 or taller guys in the paint under the rim all game long. In a league where because of the amount of physical contact allowed by the refs (Knicks-Heat playoffs games from the '90s level) - there is a much smaller amount of easy scoring opportunities.

He is used to playing in a league where he is roughed up physically and fouled on every single possession numerous times, unlike in the NBA where those will be called fouls the vast majority of the time. Some of that is allowed in the NBA playoffs, but not in the regular season. Definitely not on the perimeter, and not on the ball when heading to the rim.

He is used to playing in a league where the lane is cut off almost at all times. By comparison, the NBA will be like a dream come true for him in terms of being able to get into the lane, get lobs, get open dunk looks, etc. There is barely even ever a true posterization in an entire NBA season. When there is one, ESPN runs it for weeks. Like Griffin on Mozgov.

Big guys are not even allowed to be in position most of the time because of the NBA defensive rules. In the Euroleague, two bigs are standing under the rim almost the whole game. It will be wide open for Vesely like never before to throw down on people in the NBA.

And the most important of all........in the NBA you are allowed to travel. They don't let you travel in Euroleague. You could take away literally 90% of all LeBron James and Dwyane Wade dunks that they get in the NBA if you put them in the Euroleague. Just on the difference in the travel rules and calls alone. All those dunks they get on travels in NBA games are illegal plays in the Euroleague, and the refs would actually enforce it.

Give Vesey 3-5 steps without a dribble (you get 2-2.5 in Euroleague and the rule is enforced), give him the first step without having to dribble, give him an open lane, and bigs that can only slide over to defend (due to the 3 seconds defense rule), rather than camp under the basket (like in Euroleague) and Vesely will instantly be much more impacting athletically in the NBA than he has ever been, or could ever be, in the Euroleague.

Just the difference of in the NBA where they allow you to take the first step before the first dribble hits the floor - that is illegal in the Euroleague and is a travel and the refs enforce it. In the NBA they most of the time even let you take the first step before you even begin to dribble, and often let you take 2 steps before. Would be a travel call every single time in Euroleague.

And the Euroleague is not like the Olympics, like NBA fans think it is. No way. In the Olympics they let a lot of that travel stuff go. The play is more physical and they are more lenient on fouls a lot like Euroleague, but they let a lot of that travel stuff go.

Not really for anyone other than Team USA . But for Team USA they let it go, because they are not really used to playing in any other way, due to how the NBA game is played. They don't let any of that go in the Euroleague. And even then, the play is more physical than the Olympics. Because you are allowed to set moving picks, moving screens, hip check the ball handler, throw your shoulder into the ball handler - all legal 100% in the Euroleague. NBA fans seem to equate what they see Team USA doing at the Olympics to what those same players would do in the Euroleague, which is ridiculous and absurd. Half the Team USA possessions that are allowed in the Olympics would be travels in the Euroleague. None of those fast break lob shows from 2008, or 2010 World Championship, with all the blatant travels would even be allowed in a Euroleague game.

NBA is an entertainment show in the regular season mostly. It does not even become an actual serious competition until the playoffs, and even then it is mostly controlled by the refs. The Olympics or FIBA World Basket is a spectacle/serious sporting competition, with generally lenient refs, but with undeniable ref influence whenever it is needed (USA, Spain, or home country is playing). Euroleague is a wrestling match, not a WWE one, but a real one. They don't care if games are played in the 60s scores.

That is what Vesely is used to. Strict adherence to true travel rules and defenses that can hit you with hip checks, shoulder blocks, moving screens, and moving picks all 100% legally - with a true pure zone (not the pseudo zone the NBA allows) and less room on the court. The 3 point corners are about the same distance as the NBA, but the out of bounds line at the sidelines is closer. The 3 point line at the elbows is closer and the court is narrower. The 3 point line is closer at the top of the key, and the court is shorter. Therefore players can close out on defense much easier.

The 3 point line is further than it was in FIBA as NBA fans remember and the court is smaller in effect of what the defense has to cover, with a further 3 shot. NBA fans all seem to believe these new rules changes will make it more "NBA like" and easier for Team USA's "superior athleticism on offense". Wrong, it makes it even harder to score and easier for the defense on the perimeter. The only thing that is easier than the old rules on offense is with the rectangle lane, low post players can score more easily -IF they can shoot from close mid-range, because the true zones are still allowed.

You get about 1/5 as many open jump shots in the Euroleague as you do in the NBA, and when they are open, the defense can rotate and close out fairly easy if they want to. Shooting 3s in the Euroleague is much harder than in the NBA because they are defended shots the big majority of the time. A 23 foot shot that is almost always defended (Euroleague 3 pointers) is much harder than a 25 foot shot that is usually not defended (NBA 3 pointers). Because the space is so small at the elbows and corners in Euroleague, you effectively lose the sides of the court from the perimeter. The area the defense has to cover is much less and the spacing becomes much worse. Etc., etc., etc.

Vesely will be able to use his athletic ability much more and far easier in the NBA than he ever has been able to in the Euroleague.
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LOLOL. Yep the NBA has just series of Jan Vesley highlights these past two years.

#30 kevC, Jun 25, 2013

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kevC said: ↑

LOLOL. Yep the NBA has just series of Jan Vesley highlights these past two years.
Click to expand...

So much hilarity in that post I couldn't read anymore of it. LOL

#31 RocketsRed14, Jun 25, 2013
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Carl Herrera said: ↑

He's only 23, very athletic, was a 6th overall pick not long ago and spent time with a dumb team who doesn't know how to develop guys. Too soon to call him a bust?
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It didn't stop you from calling TRob a bust.

#32 crash5179, Jun 25, 2013
Carl Herrera Member

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crash5179 said: ↑

It didn't stop you from calling TRob a bust.
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Exactly my point.

#33 Carl Herrera, Jun 25, 2013

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Carl Herrera said: ↑

He's only 23, very athletic, was a 6th overall pick not long ago and spent time with a dumb team who doesn't know how to develop guys. Too soon to call him a bust?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, the dumb team also doesn't know how to scout guys.

#34 JuanValdez, Jun 25, 2013
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Carl Herrera said: ↑

Exactly my point.
Click to expand...

Of course, TRob was only two-thirds of a season into his career at the time of the trade, rather than two full seasons. So the level of "soon-ness" isn't really equal.

#35 bucket, Jun 25, 2013
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bucket said: ↑

Of course, TRob was only two-thirds of a season into his career at the time of the trade, rather than two full seasons. So the level of "soon-ness" isn't really equal.
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Total minutes played in the NBA as of this moment:

Vesely: 1679
Robinson: 1056

So are we 623 minutes away from being able to declare Robinson a bust?

#36 Carl Herrera, Jun 25, 2013
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Why is this being debated? Both of those guys are garbage.

#37 Baqui99, Jun 25, 2013
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More gems

OHMSS said: ↑

Vesely will be the most athletic player in the entire NBA.
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OHMSS said: ↑

I have watched as many NBA games or more than anyone in this forum. The only players in the NBA that are at Vesely's level of athleticism are Blake Griffin and maybe LeBron James. That is it.
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#38 kevC, Jun 25, 2013

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xiki Member

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Panda23 said: ↑

is she like 6ft5?
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lying down?

#39 xiki, Jun 25, 2013
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kevC said: ↑

More gems
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Hahahahaha Rocket Booster/ OHMSS got owned!!!

#40 Drew_Le, Jun 25, 2013

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