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1970 tape recording of Kent State shootings reveals sound of pistol shots

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by basso, Oct 10, 2010.

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  1. basso

    basso Member
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    WaPo , via the Plain Dealer.

    guess it's a little late for Michener to write an update.
    --
    CLEVELAND - A tape recording of the 1970 shooting deaths of four Kent State University students by Ohio National Guardsmen reveals the sound of pistol shots 70 seconds earlier, a newspaper reported Friday citing the work of a forensic audio expert.

    The finding lends support to a theory that the guardsmen thought they were being shot at during a campus Vietnam War protest. Witnesses said at the time that an FBI informant monitoring the protest fired warning shots because he felt threatened.

    The National Guard opened fire on student protesters on May 4, 1970, killing four and injuring nine others. Eight guardsmen were acquitted of federal civil rights charges four years later. Many believe the events contributed to the change in the public's attitude toward the war, which ended five years later.

    The reel-to-reel audio recording was made by a Kent State student who placed a microphone at a windowsill in his dormitory, which overlooked the antiwar rally. He later turned the tape over to the FBI. A copy eventually wound up in a Yale University archive.

    That's where Alan Canfora, a protester wounded by the Guard gunfire, found it in 2007.

    Forensic audio expert Stuart Allen conducted an extensive review of the recording at the request of Cleveland's Plain Dealer newspaper, and he detected four shots matching the acoustic signature of a .38-caliber revolver firing.

    Terry Norman, a Kent State student photographing protesters that day for the FBI, was carrying a loaded .38-caliber revolver under his coat, the newspaper said.

    Norman told a reporter on the day of the shootings that he was carrying the pistol for protection because protesters had threatened his life when he photographed earlier sit-ins. He has denied firing it. The presidential commission that investigated the shootings determined that he played no role in them.

    A crew from Cleveland's WKYC-TV filmed Norman running toward guardsmen and police and being chased by two men. One of the men yelled: "Hey, stop that man! I saw him shoot someone!" The crew recorded Norman handing a gun to a police officer, saying, "The guy tried to kill me." Norman later said he was referring to an assault that happened after the Guard shootings.

    Former WKYC reporter Fred DeBrine and soundman Joe Butano have said they heard a Kent State police detective open the cylinder of Norman's gun and say: "Oh my God, he fired four times." The detective denied making the remark. A campus patrolman's report said the gun was fully loaded with no smell of burned powder.

    DeBrine and Butano repeated their assertion this week, the Plain Dealer reported. The paper said Norman has remained elusive for decades and could not be reached for comment.
     
    #1 basso, Oct 10, 2010
  2. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Chorus: Conspiracy Junction, what's your Function?

    Basso: Hooking up hearsay, and rumors, and lies

    Chorus: Conspiracy Junction, how's that function?

    Basso: I got 3 of my cars that get most of my job done

    Chorus: Conspiracy Junction, what's their Function?

    Basso: I got FOX, blogs, and pundits that get me pretty far...

    <object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/mkO87mkgcNo?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/mkO87mkgcNo?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>
     
    #2 Sweet Lou 4 2, Oct 10, 2010
  3. Rashmon

    Rashmon Member

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    Really, basso? I mean, really?

    [​IMG]

    Your point? What candidate are you trying to besmirch with this tidbit?
     
    #3 Rashmon, Oct 10, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2010
  4. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Member

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    What is your problem with this thread exactly?
     
    #4 Bandwagoner, Oct 10, 2010
  5. SuperBeeKay

    SuperBeeKay Member

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    So what message are we supposed to get out of this article? :confused:
     
    #5 SuperBeeKay, Oct 10, 2010
  6. Joshfast

    Joshfast "We're all gonna die" - Billy Sole
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    Obama's bad.
     
    #6 Joshfast, Oct 10, 2010
  7. basso

    basso Member
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    i was 12 when the shootings happened, and i read Michener's book when it first came out, which i felt gave a fairly balanced view of the tragedy.

    that said, it's been ~35 years since i read it, so i may not remember every detail. the protests/riots/shootings were hugely controversial. the national guard always maintained they were being shot at, and this evidence would seem to show why they might have had that impression.

    in any case, i think Obama was still undergoing muslim indoctrination in indonesia at the time, so there is no relevance to anything that's happening today.

    but i think Terry Norman's got some 'splainin' to do.
     
    #7 basso, Oct 10, 2010
  8. basso

    basso Member
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    you know she wasn't a student, right?
     
    #8 basso, Oct 10, 2010
  9. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Since I was stupid enough to click on your post, what possible difference could it make? And as for your other "comments," such as they are, and they never amount to much, how many of the Guardsmen claimed they were being fired at? How many were shot and wounded? How many of the students were found to have guns? Weapons of any kind? You are so ****ing bizarre. I can tell you that I was NOT 12 when this happened and remember it very well.

    What is the point of this thread?
     
    #9 Deckard, Oct 10, 2010
  10. justtxyank

    justtxyank Member

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    I actually find this to be an interesting thread and worth posting. It doesn't have anything to do with Obama.
     
    #10 justtxyank, Oct 10, 2010
  11. Buck Turgidson

    Buck Turgidson Member

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    Same here. If it had been posted by most anyone else, the reception would have been different I'd imagine.
     
    #11 Buck Turgidson, Oct 10, 2010
    1 person likes this.
  12. basso

    basso Member
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    i'm not sure why you're so offended. new evidence after 40 years is, in and of itself, interesting. you can draw your own conclusions- personally, i don't think we'll ever be able to draw a definitive picture of what happened that day.
     
    #12 basso, Oct 10, 2010
  13. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    8 years of his crap will do that.
     
    #13 pgabriel, Oct 10, 2010
  14. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    You offend me. If you didn't start dozens of absurd, crap threads, this might have been an interesting topic for some people, but you do start dozens of crap threads, trolling for members deluded enough to think they might actually have a discussion with you, which doesn't happen. You are a troll. I'll repeat it. You are a troll. You deliberately start threads to piss people off, drag them into a "discussion" that you never participate in.

    Why are you surprised that people wouldn't take seriously any thread you start that might have been an honest attempt at having a discussion about a worthy topic? You've brought this on yourself. Your threads are like the piss on the floor around a stand up urinal. The crap most of us try not to step in. You piss on D&D and have whatever sick amusement you find from your antics. Why you are allowed to litter this place with your countless trollish threads is a mystery I'm not able to answer. I don't run this place. If I did, you would be long gone.

    You might consider taking a page from NewYorker, who decided to be a human being here, instead of a troll and a joke, basso.
     
    #14 Deckard, Oct 10, 2010
    1 person likes this.
  15. basso

    basso Member
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    then why did you open the thread, and attempt to turn it into something it's not?
    such behavior says more about you, than it does about me.

    in any case, you implied earlier that you have something to share about the topic at hand- why don't you?
     
    #15 basso, Oct 10, 2010
    1 person likes this.
  16. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Hey - I protest that!
     
    #16 Sweet Lou 4 2, Oct 10, 2010
  17. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Because we all know your silly game. Nothing you write is ever intended to spur serious conversation or debate. It's not fact checked, it's full of distortions, hearsay, and outright lies. Many of your continued ideas and claims have been long debunked, and you just come across...no, you ARE just a luny right wing conservative who clearly just HATES obama from the day you heard his name.

    THis thread...who knows what your ulterior motive is, but why legitimately discuss anything with you when you have never returned the favor?
     
    #17 Sweet Lou 4 2, Oct 10, 2010
  18. tallanvor

    tallanvor Member

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    So whether or not something is interesting to you is dependent on who posts it? Basso apparently has unbelievable power. Not matter what the topic he can make you interested if he chooses.
     
    #18 tallanvor, Oct 10, 2010
  19. Buck Turgidson

    Buck Turgidson Member

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    Oh believe me I understand the reaction. Why not, instead of jumping all over him & giving him the response he's looking for, just ignore him & talk around him?
     
    #19 Buck Turgidson, Oct 10, 2010
  20. bnb

    bnb Member

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    70 seconds between the alleged gun shots and the national guard reaction is a very long time. Not sure this changes anything? The 'cover-up' if there was such a thing seems to go the wrong way too -- making the National Guard appear even worse?

    I can't see how this justifies, or even significantly changes the reaction to the National Guards actions here. I'm failing to come up with a decent conspiracy theory here...
     
    #20 bnb, Oct 10, 2010
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