Cavs Insider article on Miami Heat Coup

Will they have to erase the Brian Windhorst Witness mural from Cleveland, too?




One question I have is whether money paid to Lebron's friends for their "jobs" in the organization should really count against the salary cap.

 

I never thought I'd say this, but thank god Yao is on Team China. :grin:

 

It would be too sweet if for some reason the HEat get Donaghy'd

Rocket River
It would just be funny

 

I think we can pretty much bank on "ESPNmiami.com" to materialize before the NBA season starts and Windhorst will probably be hired to write for it with regards to the Heat. That's my prediction.

 

Who cares?

Let's just whup their ass.

DD

 

Explain LeBrick.

LeBrick is the funniest nickname considering his field goal percentage.

 

Why do Gilbert and the Cavs get a pass? The Cavs minus Lebron are a crappy, lottery team. For 7 years, the Cavs had the best player in the league and didn't do ****. Lebron covered up the team's stink for too long. If I were a Cavs fan, I'd be pissed that ownership didn't do enough to make Lebron think the team had a future.

 

I second this. Collusion and tampering is usually bc the employers and owners are colluding not the employees. People need to get over that. Three employees from three separate companies decided that they wanted to work together. That's ok as long as they didn't share restricted information or their employer's resources to do so, and if Riley didn't actually (who is part owner) didn't try to lure them before free agency. But let's all get over the fact that the players wanted to play together. That's no different than Hakeem trying to convince drexler to come back to Houston or another player talking a friend into joining his team.

I feel bad for Cleveland and the way the decision was revealed was lameass but the but lebron had every right to leave his employer for another employer he liked better. Remember he's only had a right to choose twice in his 7 year career. This is a hard fought right every player has to choose his livelihood. I find it funny that everyone complains that it is always about the money yet when these three guys actually take a risk to get less they are still criticized. Fact is lebron's old team had a crappy supporting cast and no cap flexibility. If lebron wanted to have the best landing situation he could have maybe taken bosh to Chicago and wade would bs stuck. These guys wanted to play together and very few writers have picked them as the clear favorites. For my part I am excited to see them play although would have loved to have bosh in Houston.

 

Whats new? This is pretty much common knowledge. Raises alot of questions and looks questionable but when has the NBA ever cared? If in fact Riley was already involved? This is not legal under the NBA and if they have been for months before playoff games? Unethical by all players. Thats not to say there is anything anyone can do about it or anyone even cares. Let the guys do their thing and lets have our own team to watch. They would have probably come to this conclusion anyways of playing on the Heat. So its no big deal.

 

Ultimately, you're right. This was a perfect storm that the Heat were able to capitalize on. Three players from the same draft becoming elite players at their positions and becoming free agents at the same time is rare. Congrats to them fo rgetting it done. It doesn't affect the Rockets until we meet them in the finals. But to say nobody cares is not exactly correct. There are rules in place, and while this may seem to be no big deal, you have to hold teams accountable unless you want the entire system to break down.

When there was evidence of the Timberwolves breaking the rules, there was a consequence to be paid that they have yet to recover from. That was a team that was going to dominate for years until couple of small missteps derailed them for good. That could easily happen to the Heat, too.

The Big Three did what every one of us wants players to do... sacrifice some money to give their team the ability to add pieces for a championship. You cannot fault them for wanting to play with their friends, but if the Heat as a team did something illegal to make it happen, there should be a consequence.

 

Here is an excerpt of an article that I read after LeBron's decision that suggests that the possibility of this All-Star trio coming together was born in 2006

"The possibility of a James, Wade, Bosh trio was born in the summer of 2006 when, at the suggestion of Henry Thomas, the agent for Wade and Bosh, all three players decided to forgo five-year deals and signed matching three-year contracts with player options for the fourth year. During the summer of 2010 James, Wade, and Bosh all decided to become unrestricted free agents. These decisions made this day possible."

LeBron James' Free Agency Decision Made Possible in 2006

 

Not to mention the fact that they won a gold medal together and bonded in China. Time was, the NBA's best players were bitter rivals. Guess those days are gone. The Heat still have a heck of a lot to prove before this years-long plan can be called a success, however.

 

Tampering ehh? Not surprising.

 

Enough bitterness by the cavs fans and their stupid owner.. Players get shipped by clubs as merchandise every year at the trade deadline.. Now the players had a chance to choose.. They were FREE agents..

MJ had pippen, rodman, toni kukoc and steve kerr..

Will watch'em and Njoy.. BEAT LA..

 

There are rules against it...but far more lax in terms of enforcement.

Still - it's one thing for players to talk about it and dream about playing with their friends - completely another for Wade to go after Lebron and Bosh during the moratorium period. It gave Miami an unfair advantage that Wade was working Bosh and Lebron over while other teams couldn't even talk to them. Get rid of the 1 week moratorium period then. And it's pretty clear Wade was working with Riley and Wade was talking cap space and all that with both of those guys and not just saying - he wouldn't it be cool to play together in Miami!

I just think if the league is going to turn a blind eye here then that's fine, but then just let everyone talk to everyone else. Get rid of the whole tampering rule completely since clearly it's a farce.

 

Think again:

http://blog.mises.org/12822/nba-star-explains-the-economics-of-collusion/

Miami Heat player Dwayne Wade becomes a free agent on July 1. So does LeBron James of the Cleveland Cavaliers, Joe Johnson of the Atlanta Hawks, and Chris Bosh of the Toronto Raptors. The four men are the cream of the 2010 NBA free agent crop. And according to Wade (via the Chicago Tribune), they plan to consult one another about their decisions on where to sign:

Wade said he’s not sure when the top free agents will discuss their respective plans, though they have spoken informally in the past.

“(Free agency) has been three years coming,” Wade said. “We’ve discussed it prematurely, at different times. (But) you don’t know what guys are thinking and where they’re going. I think we’ll all sit down, and before one of us makes a decision, all of us will have spoken to each other and (listened to the) thinking.

“A lot of decisions (will be based on) what other players are willing to do and what other guys want to do. So it’s not just a ‘me’ situation here. We all have to look and see what each other is thinking.”

There’s nothing remarkable about Wade’s statements — except that he’s admitting to a felony punishable by a $1 million fine and ten years imprisonment. That’s the “max contract” for price fixing these days. And what Wade describes is in fact an illegal price-fixing cartel.

Scoff if you will, but if four firms in any industry meet to discuss what customers they plan to negotiate with, the Justice Department and the FBI will come barging in with guns blazing. Heck, as former Congressman Tom Campbell once told a House committee, if “three eye doctors in Elgin, Illinois” have lunch to discuss a proposed HMO contract, they’ll get a letter from the Federal Trade Commission advising them that said lunch violated the Sherman Act.

Campbell was not exaggerating. The FTC has prosecuted over 18,000 physicians during the past decade for essentially doing what Dwayne Wade wants to do with his fellow All-Star players — sit down and discuss potential contract offers. Former Commissioner Thomas Leary explained that it was illegal for physicians to even discuss their contract situations with one another because, “Their prime focus is on using negotiations and contracts for the purpose of enhancing their bargaining power.” And that would be a bad thing in Antitrust World; sellers are never allowed to improve their bargaining power without the federal government’s consent.

Most “price fixing” cartels are in fact little more then discussions. There are no contracts, as those would be unenforceable in government courts. An exchange of information — what contracts do you plan to bid on, what do prices do you expect to charge next year, etc. — can be mutually beneficial to “competing” firms without the need for more formal arrangements. As Wade said, “A lot of decisions (will be based on) what other players are willing to do and what other guys want to do … We all have to look and see what each other is thinking.”

Again, there’s nothing controversial in Wade’s statement. But contrast it with a press release issued by the Justice Department’s Antitrust Division announcing a coerced guilty plea from an Iowa concrete executive, Kent Stewart:

According to the charge, Stewart participated in a conspiracy in which he engaged in discussions concerning project bids for sales of ready-mix concrete in Iowa, submitted rigged bids at collusive and noncompetitive prices and accepted payment for sales of ready-mix concrete at collusive and noncompetitive prices.

Now how would this differ from Wade, LeBron James, and Chris Bosh having a discussion, agreeing they’ll all sign with the Chicago Bulls — or maybe Bosh agrees to sign with a Western Conference team so as not to compete directly against Wade and James in Chicago — and refusing to entertain offers from any other teams? This would be a case where the market participants (a) engaged in discussions concerning bids from NBA teams, (b) submitting rigged bids at “collusive and noncompetitive prices,” and ultimately (c) accepting contracts at said prices.

And although price fixing is a per se antitrust violation — meaning it’s unnecessary to show there’s any monopoly or exercise of “market power,” as in a merger case — the antitrust violation is arguably worse in the basketball players’ case then in the Stewart case cited above. Stewart colluded on the sale of concrete in Iowa City; that’s not even interstate commerce. Collusion by three or four NBA All-Stars, however, can fundamentally alter the fortunes of several teams and cities, not to mention the league’s worldwide business.

Obviously nobody expects the Justice Department to prosecute Wade or his fellow players for violating the Sherman Act. That goes against the “business model” of the Antitrust Division, which is to prey on individuals, like Kent Stewart, outside the public eye who won’t mount a defense. Prosecuting NBA players for collusion would bring unwelcome public and press scrutiny. Ideological consistency must yield to preserving the antitrust establishment’s position in the social structure.

The benefit of Wade’s remarks is that they reiterate how commonplace “collusion” is within the marketplace — and how the two are compatible, despite over a century of antitrust propaganda to the contrary. Humans are not interchangeable widgets in a machine; they’re unique individuals with their own subjective preferences. Economic decisions are not made in a vacuum, or by mathematical formula, but within a series of social relationships. When Wade says, “We all have to look and see what each other is thinking,” he’s describing an essential act of economic calculation.

This equally applies to “teams” of individuals, be they a basketball team or a business firm. If one firm chooses to share information with another about its possible business plans, that’s not a violation of anyone’s rights or destructive of marketplace competition — as opposed to the antitrust regulator who imprisons people for sharing information and demands individuals obey a rigid, illogical concept of “competition.”

 

Enlightening article and I appreciate the article. But I think the case for collusion and the three conditions above fail because there's a pretty strong defense that (b) is not true. In this case, all three took LESS money (as a whole) or risked less money to go to Miami. How can the bids be at collusive and non-competitive prices when they were all getting the max offer everywhere they were going anyway, and when they were possibly colluding to take LESS than the max they could receive? Also, teh analogy here is three employees from Dell, Sony and Toshiba whose employment contracts are up deciding they want to work for the same company. Doctors are their own employers for the most part. This is not to say employees can't collude, but NO WAY there will be a price-fixing or anti-trust charge here.

 

i don't think there will be, either.

 

Cuban will screw them, he has the way & the money to do so!
Go Cuban!!

 

Remember when it was reported that Wade was seriously interested in signing with the Bulls...I said then that it was a giant smoke screen and Wade was doing his part while Miami tried to close deals with other FAs. Looks like I was right.