Roberts: Scene at State of Union 'very troubling'

Didn't you mean clinging bitterly to your neocon fantasies of being an armchair warrior?

 

wow. so. delusional. If anything the economy is going to get hit again.

 

fixed

 

link please?

 

Why do Republicans always put prissy, prickly justices on the SC? Here's Greenwald, who writes well...

 

You changed the statement and then addressed the modified one. I said that I don't think Obama being black is why basso sees a difference between him and Reagan. You changed that to basso doesn't see Obama is black. Why?

And why are you querying me about how basso deals with race? And why am I answering? My entire point was that you bringing up the topic derails whatever interesting discussion had started in this thread. It's irrelevant.

 

so you don't know. I know. If I call someone a thief from out of the blue then that means I saw him stealing before. Don't defend the person if you don't know if he has stolen or not.

it is relevant because
1) OP is a known racebaiter
2) OP said Reagans criticism of SC is not the same as Obama's criticism of SC

have you ever saw me randomly bringing up race in other threads?

are you really defending this guy?
http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=175848&highlight=black+dumb

 

need healthcare?

 

Not this again... try ctrl +...

or click on the link.

 

I don't think you've been paying very close attention to what I'm saying. I'm not defending him. I've said several times I don't care whether he's racist or not, it is irrelevant to what I was trying to say to you. I only answered your questions as a courtesy.

Also, forgive me if I don't take your word for it on whether he actually is a racist. I've seen some of the threads where people claim his behavior is racist, including the one you linked to, and I don't necessarily agree. If you really want to have that conversation, you're going to have to provide more explanation than "because I know so".

Well, yeah. I realize you believe it's relevant. I just think that idea is far-fetched and I

 

Shoot... my scroll button twitched and I hit Submit Reply too early.

What I was going to say was I realize you believe it's relevant. I just think that idea is far-fetched and I think it's irrelevant. And seriously, your points 1 and 2 above are not even close to sufficient logic for the conclusion you came to. OP is a known Obama "hater" regardless of race could easily have been you point #1 and it would have made as much sense, if not more.

 

do you have proof of that?

I have proof of the opposite

Have you read this thread?
http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=175848&highlight=black+dumb

 

The burden of proof is on you, since you're the one making the accusation. I also find it helpful to assume people are not racist until proven otherwise.

By the way, you're using the term "proof" in a way that really just means "evidence". That thread may be evidence to back up your claim, but it is far from proof. There are other perfectly plausible scenarios that explain basso's behavior in that thread, and I personally find those other explanations significantly more likely than yours.

 

what kind of proof is needed for you to find someone is a racist?

 

I know right, maybe you photoshop basso in a kkk hood

 

That's a difficult question and a difficult answer to articulate. A big part of it is intent.

I think humans are innately prejudiced, and that often manifests itself subconsciously in our words or actions towards people of other races or cultures. I don't consider those words or actions to be racist.

I also believe that many people are simply ignorant of other cultures and of things that are offensive to other people and that can often lead to statements or actions that are insensitive and offensive to people of other races or cultures. I don't consider those words or actions to be racist.

Still in other cases, there are people who might be aware that statements or actions cause offense to other people, but who don't think they should cause offense and so they do them anyway. They are not intending to cause offense, instead they argue that no offense should be taken. I do not consider someone who does this to be racist.

In all three of those scenarios, the person is wrong for his or her statements or actions and should be criticized, but the error is not racism. I'm aware that all three of those scenarios are often present in racist people, but their presence is not sufficient for the "racist" label to be accurate.

For me to consider someone to be racist, I believe they have to honestly and purposefully show ill will towards people of another race specifically because of their race. Or they have to honestly believe that another race is inferior. I'm sure there's some other ways as well, but those seem to be pretty encompassing.

Much like "proof" is not the same as "evidence", "racist" is not the same as "prejudiced" or "ignorant" or "wrong". I hope you see the difference.


It feels wrong to comment specifically on basso's behavior here, especially since I have already done it at length in the past. But I feel I must to properly explain my opinion on the subject that you seem intent on getting. I consider basso's behavior in this forum to be much more indicative of the third scenario above than of racism. I think he is caught up in an anti-Obama fervor not because of Obama's skin color, but because of Obama's ideology. What evidence do I have of this?

First, it is rare that basso will ever concede a negative point made about Bush or any Republican, or at least that's my impression. It also seems to be rare that he acknowledges anything positive about Democrats, unless such a compliment can be considered a back-handed criticism of Obama or another Democrat. That type of behavior, to me, indicates somebody who is stuck in a deeply partisan frame of mind. When in that state of mind, they tend to make illogical, hypocritical, and even apparently racist comments and implications as means to "win" the battle against the opposition. Any opportunity to criticize or create any kind of negative appearance around the target person or persons is taken.

In addition to this type of behavior, basso constantly and consistently attempts to be witty. I know you're aware of this. When people try to be witty, they often end up saying something stupid and offensive. I think that is where a lot of basso's race-baiting comes from. To me, using names like B-fro are indicative not of somebody who is racist, but instead they indicate somebody who is trying to be witty, and doesn't think that such a term should be offensive, so they choose to use it despite the knowledge that it is offensive (or maybe even because of it).

From my perspective, basso just sees this forum as a battleground, and liberals, democrats and Obama supporters as his "enemies". His method of battle is a constant barrage of sniping, negativity and criticism, no matter how unfounded or irrelevant. When people expose the flaws in his arguments, he wants to post more because he's sure they are wrong and don't understand something that he understands. When people post stupid pictures in his threads, that emboldens him because it shows (in his mind) how petty, juvenile and unsubstantive the opposition is. When people claim he is racist, he purposefully does more race-baiting because he thinks they are wrong about the accusation and he wants to be defiant in the face of it.

This kind of behavior isn't limited to basso (although he admittedly takes it to a whole nother level). To be honest I think you do the same thing to a certain degree. The difference, other than the level, is that you haven't been accused repeatedly of racism, and so you're not trying to skirt the edges of racist posts just to be defiant.

To me, the persistent racially tinged commentary from him is his act of defiance against those who believe he is racist. His irrational positions in threads like the one you linked are a symptom of his need criticize Democrats and Obama in particular at any opportunity, and avoid conceding any error in doing so. His war against Obama stems from partisan anger that is consistently fed and reinforced by many of the posters on this forum. In my mind, none of those behaviors display true racism. And that's why I don't think he is racist, and that's why I don't think that thread or anything else I've seen on this forum is proof of such an accusation.

Sorry for the long post. I hope that clears things up for you a bit.

 

does saying all black voters are dumb count?

 

No.

Believing it would count, though. Making statements or acting in ways that indicate that you believe it would count.

But I don't think either of those apply to basso, so...

 

he did make that statement