I wanted to see what kpj looked like under Ime, but i can understand why sone didnt want him around. As much as Silas was the face of failure, kpj being the "head honcho" was also the face of losing. Its not all on kpj. The Rockets gave the keys to a volatile young guy in his twenties with behavior issues. You have a team full of young dudes being led by this guy on and off the court. Kpj and silas were the main faces of dysfunction. But Stone was the real catalyst to it all. Ime even recently acknowledged needing to change the perception of the organization. So to circle back, people this off season mainly wanted Silas, Stone and kpj gone. It wasnt really anything that either one did specifically last year but rather their body of work and what they represented. Not having 2 of the three is a pretty big turn around in regards to resetting the culture and we can see some of the differences already. We'll see if it translates to regular season wins. I think it will.
You are very late to the party though, dude will have his first hearing 2 days from now. Most folks have closed that chapter mentally and that's why they mad.
They just cannot bring him back, regardless if the league allows them to. The players have experienced life without him. I have a hard time believing a single player would even want him back in the mix. If they do, they literally have wiped out all the good work they've done this offseason.
It also does not make any sense for him to be back. He is automatically relegated to being the 12th man, I doubt he will be reinstated as the 6th man after what he did or allegedly did. Cam to me is already at the level or better than KPJ. It would be best to cut your losses, go overseas and then make an NBA comeback.
I am not sure if you nuanced position is that (1) you lament the DV case making it impossible to give Udoka a chance to coach KPJ, or (2) you think they should bring back KPJ rather than "throw away" him, or (3) you are pushing back the overwhelming sentiment that KPJ should have been gone long ago given how he has been behaving?
His stance does not really make sense, that would suggest KPJ never went to NY with his GF and never laid a hand on her. Impossible.
He was still the same dude with zero self control. Whether on the court "running' a team, at practice, in the club or with his girl. The moron giving him the keys and the contract failed to realize that it could make him even worse. And it did. Either way he's gone. The few still hoping otherwise need to realize it's over. This thread can finally fade away. It was obvious at the open practice, they're going to change the image and culture of the team. He wasn't going to help them anyway. Beside the fact the team flows better without him, he would not have lasted under Udoka. Again, no self control. The obvious speaks for itself.
OK. Agree to disagree that the point of threads is to argue about someone's stunted hypothetical (except apparently D&D), but I'll indulge: 1. If a guy has a pattern of being a maladjusted anti social psychopath, first in college, second on his drafted team, and thirdly on his second team where the GM treated him like his own son, "a month with Ime" isn't what he needs. He needs a swift kick in the ass as least and institutionalization at most. At best Ime would be strict mom while Stone would still be enabler dad. 2. Getting kicked from college was enough of a red flag to drop him in the draft. Getting kicked from his draft team was enough of a red flag to get him dumped for free. Leaving an NBA game at half time on his new team was enough to get cut again* (but Stone was his enabler). (Name another time a player has left a sports game at half of his own free will?) 3. If you require a smoking gun article from a major media source that elucidates intricate details on any of the above or KPJs interactions with coaches and teammates not listed above, it's not out there. You have to grapple that information asymmetry exists and that ny itself does not make a concept less true. 4. This stuff has been beaten senseless for 2 full years. At this point it is like debating whether the earth is flat. 5. KPJ is a street baller and at no point was his impact on the court enough to justify his interactions with the team and his impact on franchise perception. 5. Because of points 1-5, if you continue to push this faux innocence schtick you are going to get hostility.
The NBA as an organization has a responsibility......to deny them entry to the Draft. Should be standards of sanity and normal behavior in place.
I think I’ve been pretty clear that I’m talking about prior to the DV stuff. I’m pushing back against the idea that it was a no brainer to get rid of him because he simply had an attitude problem. It’s a moot point, but I’m not sure why it’s so difficult to follow — even if you don’t agree.
1) anti social psychopath? That’s quite the armchair diagnosis. 2) all of that happened prior to last year — there were no incidents outside of attitude last year (and there was plenty of that to go around). 3) sorry I require a little more evidence that message board rumors and vague, general statements by best writers and former players when deciding to dump a very talented player? 4) just because you’ve decided it’s settled doesn’t mean nobody can talk about it. Don’t like it? Don’t engage. 5) disagree. Want to see him with a strong coach. We made ALLLLL this fuss about how generationally AWFUL Silas was and how everyone is going to see tremendous improvement under Ime…but we can’t include kpj in that optimism? 5) not even sure what you’re referring to I didn’t bump some old thread. It was active. I chimed in. Why so serious?
The investment and the drama for a guy who MIGHT have developed into a decent 6th or 7th man is just bizarre.
I kind of thought it was #3 but wondered why you would still try to argue. As you said, it's a moot point now, A lot of KPJ fans have stopped arguing. The difference between you and those who think he shouldn't have been kept for so long is pretty much how his talent is perceived. You and some others think his talent was good enough to continue with the hope that he could be great under a good coach. Those of us think he was not worth the trouble think that his talent is nothing special. Even if some miracle coach could rein him in, he would be at best an average starter or a good 6th man on a good team. (BTW, John Lucas was supposed to be the miracle guy who could turn him around.) With his history of troubles, the likelihood of getting him on track was not very good to begin with. We can agree to disagree. It's not that hard to find an NBA guard who has KPJ's level of talent. He is a high risk mediocre return kind of investment. Not a good investment decision.
Is KPJ still on the team? I personally doubt that he will be convicted of any wrongdoing for this incident. Reason: No witnesses to any domestic violence. Also, whatever happened doesn't look like the other party is cooperating. My guess is that she might get a nice payday under the table and this will be hard to . Kysre Gondrezick's lawyer breaks silence on alleged Kevin Porter assault (nypost.com) Also, Kysre has not made any statements to law enforcement or the media according to NY Post: The source familiar with the former WNBA player told us that Gondrezick, “has not given a statement to [law enforcement] and complained to them that what’s being attributed to her is inaccurate and to stop it. These are not her words.” If KPJ is acquitted, then what? I predict by how Stone has treated KPJ in the past, the Rockets will still keep him, possibly try to trade him, but probably not cut him. Even if the NBA decides to suspend KPJ, he could be considered innocent if he hasn't been proven guilty and the punishment by the NBA could be considered sufficient. How the team, owners, and coaches think of KPJ will determine what happens. I'm hopeful that KPJ can be coached and be an awesome player, but I'm also hopeful that Van Vleet, Tate, Whitmore, and Thompson can provide equal or greater value than him and we won't need him.
Even with some miraculous exoneration in court I don't want him back on this team. The only exoneration would mean she refused to testify / cooperate with the prosecution. We already know he beat her ass .... To me, it's a done deal. Goodbye and good riddance. Let's forget the turd exists, no more pages added to this thread about an asshat being an asshat.
I don't expect much in terms of severity for his punishment either and I fully expect him back in the league at some point. Why? Because he is young and talented and professional sports basically always gives these guys another chance. Will it be in Houston? No way. That ship has definitely sailed. I do think he will play again though. He will get a time out, some "counseling", and a finely crafted PR image makeover, and the league will eventually welcome him back with open arms. Pretty sure we've all seen this movie before...
You underestimate what no real games will do to athletes......he may be back but I doubt he will be the same, not that I did think highly of his skills. And of course other teams will use him as some spare parts, he very likely would not be seen as the head honcho.......the Rockets actually did him some harm coddling him. Just a street baller who is not that good in a team setting.
While I absolutely agree this to happen with talented players, I don’t think that 1) KPJ is talented enough to be worth the trouble and 2) keep in mind that KPJ has already had a history of conduct issues before this
No witnesses? Hotel staff entered the room and found the victim at least cut up and bruised (severity depends on the source, it seems). There’s no universe where KPJ isn’t convicted on some type of assault. The circumstantial evidence is overwhelming
