[Official] Indians @ Astros

Since we lost the D-Backs series, we have gone 9-3. with all 3 losses being by one run.

We are 30-18, despite being 4-9 in one run games overall. Hopefully that starts to even out as the season goes.

 

Last night I listened to the Indians booth. What I kept hearing over and over was "This isnt who we are", "This is a very good team despite the record", "Last year, our bullpen was our strength, if we can just get that right".

Despite being under .500, they insist they are an elite team that could go deep in the playoffs.

Well, I guess these opinions are to be expected. You dont throw your own team under the bus unless your planning on retiring.

I suppose I have always been of the opinion that your team is what your record says you are, so it was becoming annoying to me that the Cleveland booth seemed to dismiss their record as irrelevant.

Its probably about the same when listening to the Dodgers booth these days.

So, are teams in denial or what? Maybe your team isn't what your record says you are?

 

If the Astros pitching staff's gave up 1 more run in every game, the Astros would still be 26-22. So many wasted good pitching outings.

 

The Indians record wasnt that good last year either. They were 31-30. Then they started playing a little better, and then the win streak and they got the best record in the AL.

 

Indians and Dodgers are much better than their records suggests. That said, Dodgers have some injury problems to work out, and Indians look merely like a great team as their bullpen looks awfully thin. Bullpens are fixable. Injuries are much tougher to overcome.

 

The Dodgers dealing with Seagers injury may be in some trouble, but both of these teams will still be heard from. Baseball isn't like basketball and football, your record may in fact lie as to your true level this early in the season.

The Indians bullpen is a disaster right now, it's a complete 180 from last season.

 

The Astros weren't a crappy sub-0.500 team last July/August either. Cleveland and LA last year weren't the best teams in history when they had their epic stretches. Good teams/players get have extended poor stretches all the time (magnified when they are the start of the season). Bad teams/players have extended good stretches also. If I'm the Dodgers or Indians, I'm not terribly concerned - their players have solid track records the last few years. It may not work out and they really may suck all season - just as players have random down seasons - but the talent is there. They just have to work themselves out of the messes they've created.

 

What's the difference between what they say and what the Astros management, team, announcers and fans say? Astros have been saying most of the year how the offense will come around.

 

I was talking about the Indians, mostly. So I am not sure what your point is.

 

You really don’t see his point?

 

I think his point is that Astros fans/management/etc are saying the same things about their weaknesses as the Indians have been. And the same as most other teams that have unexpected underperformers.

 

There’s plenty of examples of teams not playing to their record, both positively and negatively. The Rangers way outplayed their record a few seasons ago and promptly lost in the first round as their underlying metrics suggested their true talent was.

 

I'd be shocked if the Dodgers made any noise in the Playoffs (or even made the playoffs). They're without Kershaw for at least a couple more weeks and there's no reason to believe that he'll avoid another DL stint the rest of the season. Rich Hill is out for the next 4-5 weeks with blister issues. Seager's injury is obviously huge. Granted, there aren't any teams running away with that division, but the odds are definitely against the Dodgers making the playoffs, let alone doing anything substantial once they get there.

 

My point is that the Astros are doing the exact same thing you seemed to chide the Indians announcers for doing. Blum and Kalas oftentimes talk about how the offense will eventually break out. So, is the Astros offense what they are or is it better?

The only difference is that the Astros record is better. However, had the Astros offense performed on par with last year and the pitching performed the same way, then we'd be looking at a 120 win pace.

So, if the Indians announcers are annoying, then the Astros announcers, staff, management and fans are annoying as well - correct?

This seems to be one of those annoying fans:

Whether it happened last year or not, almost the entire offense is in a funk and needs to get better. Over the last 7 days, only (2) Astros have hit better than .250 (Springer/Altuve). (3) guys are hitting at or below .100 !!!

This has to change. It will change.

 

What I found annoying is the claim. The claim that something is true, but it isnt unless this and that happen.

The annoying fans post you use as an illustration doesn't seem to be claiming anything that wasn't well rooted in the stats of the time. Unlike the Cleveland booth claiming they are (present tense) claiming to be a great team while losing more games than they have won.

Sure, many a Houstonian has predicted the offense will get better. Predictions are one thing. Claims about the present are another.

If the Cleveland booth had said "You know, we might be really good if we can fix our bullpen", then I wouldn't have had a problem with it.

 

Doubtful. Even with as bad sequencing as the Astros have had this year, it is hard to imagine they would only be on pace to win 120 games with last year's offense and this year's pitching.

 

Being a closer is not just about racking up saves. Especially when your manager is handing you the easiest saves by having another pitcher start the 9th inning with a 3 run lead and getting an out for you against some of the other team's best hitters. Keone Keta, Brad Ziegler, and Bud Norris all have 8 or more saves with no blown saves. Does that make them dominant closers? Keta has a 5.06 era, Ziegler a 7.20 era, and Norris is pitching well with a 2.01 era. Giles is sporting a 3.60 era. It's not terrible, but among closers he is in the bottom 3rd in ERA, batting average against, and k/9.

So no I don't trust a guy that lost his job in the playoffs and lost his job again earlier in this season.

The playoffs are a totally different animal. For example, Jose Altuve hit more playoff home runs in one game than Bagwell did in his career. Bagwell was a monster in the regular season. In the playoffs he wasn't even average.

 

True about Bagwell. However, he was usually hitting in front of clowns in the early playoff years. No excuse in ‘98 except that Kevin Brown was unhittable.

Yes we should have hit hitchcock. Also, who could forget the Leyritz roid shot off wags?

 

5 additional wins puts them at a 118.5 pace.

 

Do you have a problem with Astros personnel saying the same thing about the offense? because they are.