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Luka Doncic: Top 5 pick when available

Discussion in 'NBA Draft' started by _RTM_, Jun 24, 2016.

  1. Normalus

    Normalus Member

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    I believe this is wrong, they can. Seen ton of that this season. They have probably changed the rules recently.
     
  2. Koperboy

    Koperboy Member

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    Out of curiousity I read about it in euroleague rules (they are same as FIBA rules which spain league uses) and it says nothing about using instant replay to upgrade the penalty (in Luka's case from normal foul to unsportsmanlike). Decision can still be changed, but not with instant review:

    Article 4. Any Time Instant replay can be referred to in the following situations:

    4.1. An error/malfunction occurs in the game clock and it does not stop after the referee blows the whistle, or the game clock starts running before the ball is in play. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issues only: how much time actually expired and how much time (if any) is remaining in the period.

    4.2. An error/malfunction occurs in the shot clock and it does not stop after the referee blows the whistle, or the shot clock starts running before the ball is in play. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issues only: how much time actually expired and how much time (if any) is remaining on the shot clock.

    4.3. Individuals engage in a fight. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issues only: the identity of all individuals involved in the fight, as well as the appropriate penalty for each individual.

    4.4. A player is fouled in the act of shooting for a field goal. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issue only: whether the field goal attempt was a two-point or threepoint field goal.

    4.5. The referees are unsure whether a field goal made was a twopoint or three-point field goal. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issue only: whether the field goal made was a two-point or three-point field goal. The review will take place at the following dead ball when the game clock is stopped.

    4.6. The referees are unsure whether a shot clock violation occurred immediately prior to a field goal made. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issue only: whether the ball left the hand of the shooter prior to the illumination of the yellow LED light (signalling the end of the 24-second period). The review will take place at the following dead ball when the game clock is stopped.

    4.7. The referees are unsure whether a shot clock violation occurred immediately prior to a foul called. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issue only: whether the foul that was called occurred prior to the illumination of the yellow LED light (signalling the end of the 24-second period).

    4.8. The referees are unsure whether a foul off the ball called on the team without control of the ball occurred immediately prior to a field goal made. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issue only: whether the foul that was called occurred prior to the shooter commencing the act of shooting.

    4.9. The referees are unsure whether a foul off the ball called on the team with control of the ball occurred immediately prior to a field goal made. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issue only: whether the foul that was called occurred prior to the ball leaving the hand of the shooter.

    4.10. The referees are unsure who the correct free-throw shooter is. The referees will review the footage to determine the following issue only: the identity of the correct free-throw shooter.
     
  3. Alugeris

    Alugeris Member

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    I'm sure the ref called unsportsmanlike foul instantly. Or was it not on Dončić initially?
    Plus, I've seen several cases this season when regular foul has been upgraded after a review.
     
  4. Koperboy

    Koperboy Member

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    Luka's statistics for this year. Numbers like this would make even best Euroleague players proud, and Doncic is doing this at 18y old. If he isn't picked in Top3, I'll be a bit disappointed.


    [​IMG]
     
  5. basketballholic

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    It's him or Trae #1. And the other one #2.
     
  6. ipaman

    ipaman Contributing Member

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    Can't go wrong with either Doncic or Young but if I were picking I would grab Doncic. The problem for both is you have the BIGS who look great this draft. Ayton, Bagley, and even Bamba are hard to pass up. I think Bamba is Capela 2.0 but with bigger upside defensively.
     
  7. omgTHEpotential

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    Can't really go wrong with Doncic. I keep saying that he has the highest floor in the draft. He's just not gonna bust.
     
    dmoneybangbang and YaoMing#1 like this.
  8. Swiss Roll

    Swiss Roll Member

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    35th percentile in isolation in euro ball concern me, unless the defensive rules over there pretty much neutralize isolations I doubt he has the potential to become a top 5 player in the NBA, the same cannot be said about Young, Bagley, and Ayton. I had him in the top 3 until Young (should be #1 overall) exploded onto the scene. The P&R Ball Handler, Transition, Spot up and Off Screen percentiles are amazing tho, at best, I see him on offense as a less efficient Klay Thompson, with James Harden level play-making (10 assists, 5 turnovers), His length is passable (similar height/standing reach ratios to Carmelo, Joe Johnson), and he seems fundamentally sound on defense, but I think against NBA level athletes what you should expect is "Not a Liability" at most.

    I'd take him 4th, maybe 5th depending on how you view Porter.
     
  9. blahblehblah

    blahblehblah Member

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    Seems like a good kid with great skill/talent for someone so young. But I cant see him being anything more than a good/solid starter in the NBA (which is quite an accomplishment really).

    The problem i see is that he is just two slow footed. He wont be averaging nearly 10 fta's in the nba or anything close to that, which he's currently doing now in the euro league and is one of the primary reasons he's been so successful. He'll have much more difficulties in ISO and even in switches off the pick and roll in the NBA, due to the simple fact that NBA defenders will be much quicker, longer and better. In fact as the post above me points out, he already isnt that great at iSO in the euroleague.

    His shooting will definitely help, especially his ability to shoot off the dribble. His passing, craftiness and ball handling are all very good, but I think he'll find it difficult to create shots, get to the line and playmake in the NBA.

    Disclaimer: have never watched him play, aside from highlight videos and scouting videos on youtube.
     
  10. Swiss Roll

    Swiss Roll Member

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    I think his passing will be his primary asset coming into the league, At worst he will hang around as a solid starter in the league for a decade plus, hes not slow, and changes speed pretty well when slowing down, shown by his elite numbers in transition.

    The primary problem I see with him is, stupid as it sounds, is that hes TOO skilled for his age. There are serious concerns about how much better he can really get (which is insane for an 18 year old). I think the shooting should improve, as well as further refining of finishing around the rim and decision making, as well as strength just with the quality of NBA training. Explosion, on the other hand, cannot be substantially improved for someone who is already an athlete by craft. Guys like Nikola Jokic can get away with having no explosiveness by having the best post game in the NBA (#1 in post PPP for 3+ post-ups per game) and being built like a tank. Doncic might just be the second best 18 year old player of all time, and likely never makes an All-NBA team.

    Another problem is how do you build an offense to maximize the talent of Doncic? He's clearly elite with his playmaking and passing, but projects to be below average in Isolation, both require the ball to be in his hands. He scores the best when hes running off a screen, spotting up, in transition, and cutting to the rim, all of which require the ball to be taken out of Doncic's hands for most of the possession. Simply put, hes too good of a playmaker to be running off screens all the time, but hes not good enough of an ISO scorer to justify the ball being in his hands all the time. Imagine a hybrid of JR Smith's off ball abilities and ISO ineptitude and Draymond Green's passing. How do you use such a player?
     
  11. Normalus

    Normalus Member

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    He may end up as very good ISO player though. You can't sit in the paint for more than 3 seconds in NBA, and the court is bigger than European.
     
  12. Koperboy

    Koperboy Member

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    An interesting article on Doncic from The Ringer, also outlining his weakness:

    https://www.theringer.com/nba/2018/1/9/16866612/luka-doncic-trae-young-steph-curry-generation
     
  13. snowconeman22

    snowconeman22 Member

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    I would be worried about upside from athleticism, but it wouldn't be enough of a concern to not take him top 5. A lot of people are saying that athleticism can't improve, but I think the fact that he's 18 and will be moving to an NBA strength training program bodes a bit well for him. He's got enough size and skill that he should be able to find a way to score pretty consistently. I know teams in the top-5 are looking for a player to "build" around , but the question of how do you build around a player is less important than is the player going to be good. He's going to be a guy that wont have to have an offense built around him to be efficient.
     
  14. Normalus

    Normalus Member

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    I'm afraid you are wrong about this one.
     
  15. snowconeman22

    snowconeman22 Member

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    I don't see why . Isn't his best attribute his high skill level . He can shoot off ball , he can handle in the PnR .
     
  16. Normalus

    Normalus Member

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    Remains to be seen. He played for 1 team, with a lot of the same players, his whole career. And he needs the ball in his hands quite often to make any presence.
     
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  17. omgTHEpotential

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    I get that the writer wants to hype up Ayton, but can he please shut the **** up about Ayton being faster than Doncic/Trae? He might be very fast for a 7 footer, but no way is he faster than a guard. Ludicrous hyperbole. People say this about Embiid too - that he's as fast as a guard. There's literally zero ****ing evidence of that. He's not even the fastest center, IMO.
     
  18. YaoMing#1

    YaoMing#1 Member

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    Capela is the fastest center hands down. The guy runs like a gazelle.

    Luka is the man I would take him top 3.

    IMO Ayton should go 1 even though I’m a bigger fan of Doncic.

    Nobody is passing up on a guy who’s more advanced than embiid was coming out of college and has no injury history. Ayton can be a top 5 player in the nba at his peak, doncic cannot imo.

    But doncic can straight ball. I would trade everyone on the rockets outside of harden cp3 and Capela for him. Every player and draft pick can go as far as I’m comcerned. He’s the kind of guy that if he went to houston, San Antonio or golden state, he would play a huge role from day one and be one of the 5 best players on the team.

    If doncic is your 3rd best player on a championship team, your talking dynasty imo. The kid knows the game an pass, will benefit playing in the nba having more space. He defense will be better imo because he body type will be an asset for the new switch everything style. He’ll be a 40% 3 point shooter by his 3rd year. And as a secondary ball handler he’ll get 6 assist.

    He prob won’t avg 20 ppg but I expect him to be a 15/6/6 with high efficiency very early on in his career.

    Trae young has gotten overrated. I def think he’s a lock for top 8 but I don’t think he goes top 5 as of now. He game fits the modern nba no doubt about that but he’s small he’s weak and his non existent on defense. He’s also not an elite shooter. He’s good but not elite.

    He will excel as a pick and roll player he’s def elite at that and that is a major major skill set for the nba.

    Bagely looks like a cant miss guy like Doncic imo. He’s just a good player and should do well at the next level.

    Porter jr I don’t know anything about but for some reason I just think he’s going to be a bust. I hate when players get compared to Durant. It’s doing the kid a disservice. He’s talk athletic and can shoot but apparently he’s not a very good one on one player and struggles with ball handling.
     
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  19. omgTHEpotential

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    I agree with pretty much everything you said here. Ayton has a higher ceiling, but he can also easily become a bust. Doncic on the other hand, has the highest floor in the draft (I can't imagine him busting), but not the highest ceiling (I can't imagine him ever being in the conversation for the MVP).
     
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  20. Swiss Roll

    Swiss Roll Member

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    Doncic's 3 pointer has fallen off a cliff, and he isn't quick enough to beat anyone off the dribble. I could easily see him busting and I would pick Trae Young over him at this point.
     

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