1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

[HOPE KEPT ALIVE] The Impeachment Trial of Donald John Trump

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by SamFisher, Dec 18, 2019.

  1. mick fry

    mick fry Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2013
    Messages:
    19,343
    Likes Received:
    6,875
    Playing the Dems like a fiddle.
     
  2. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2002
    Messages:
    55,911
    Likes Received:
    47,621
  3. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    53,825
    Likes Received:
    53,619
    Due process? Perhaps you are confusing this with a criminal court case. This is an impeachment... completely different set of standards, completely different set of possible outcomes.
     
  4. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    53,825
    Likes Received:
    53,619
    Looks like they did.
     
  5. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    53,825
    Likes Received:
    53,619
  6. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2007
    Messages:
    50,145
    Likes Received:
    40,819
    Yep. This was literally the talking point before the Democrats started impeachment. We had people here even saying that the Democrats should stop being scared and do it...democrats do it and it flips around to "Democrats were stupid to do this."

    Democrats need to listen to the people that actually might vote for them, not Trump's base, when it comes to strategy.
     
    mdrowe00 and RayRay10 like this.
  7. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    72,469
    Likes Received:
    110,429
    Has the President been impeached or not? Josh Blackman argues the Senate should just ask:

    https://reason.com/2019/12/20/the-s...s-been-impeached-for-purposes-of-art-i-sec-2/

    The Senate should ask the House if the President has been impeached for purposes of Art. I, Sec. 2
    A simple communication could resolve any doubts about the status of the President's impeachment

    Josh Blackman |The Volokh Conspiracy | 12.20.2019 11:09 AM

    Has the President been impeached? Depends who you ask. One way to resolve this debate is for the Senate to inquire. That is, the Senate could send a formal communication to the House, and ask if the President has been impeached for purposes of Art. I, Sec. 2. The House could say "yes" or "no." And that communication would resolve the debate. Or the House could simply ignore the request, which suggests that the House is not yet prepared to announce its decision, or that the House simply has no interest in responding to the Senate's request. Either way, this communication could provide the Senate, and the public, with some greater clarity about where we stand on this important question. I see little downside for the Senate to send such a communication

    I thank my colleague Seth Barrett Tillman for offering this suggestion.
     
  8. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Messages:
    34,620
    Likes Received:
    33,563
    Ah yes, the acreage model of democracy... NOT spelled out in our founding documents but still so fun!

    Amazing that we won the cold war when the Soviet Union had such an acreage advantage!
     
    dmoneybangbang, Amiga, Nook and 3 others like this.
  9. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    72,469
    Likes Received:
    110,429
    nice turn of phrase! but of course acreage is not the real issue, e.g.,

    "As James Madison said, 'the government ought to be founded on a mixture of the principles of proportional and equal representation'. "​

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federalist_No._62
     
  10. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2003
    Messages:
    58,732
    Likes Received:
    36,182
    That map could use a sharpie edit of Alaska drawn to actual scale.

    Also, "try to Impeach this" should be corrected to "this was impeached"
     
    Deckard, B-Bob, DaDakota and 2 others like this.
  11. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    123,886
    Likes Received:
    32,775
    Proper map by population.

    [​IMG]

    DD
     
    Deckard, No Worries, B-Bob and 2 others like this.
  12. Rashmon

    Rashmon Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2000
    Messages:
    19,155
    Likes Received:
    14,307
    [​IMG]
     
    Deckard and B-Bob like this.
  13. Nook

    Nook Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    53,805
    Likes Received:
    111,568
    [​IMG]
     
  14. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    72,469
    Likes Received:
    110,429
    Alaska and Hawaii apparently don't exist :rolleyes:
     
  15. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,941
    Likes Received:
    12,825
    He’s dead and been dead. How about we have a system for the 21st century?
     
  16. Rashmon

    Rashmon Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2000
    Messages:
    19,155
    Likes Received:
    14,307
  17. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2002
    Messages:
    55,911
    Likes Received:
    47,621
    [​IMG]

    Facts and logic.
     
    No Worries and Nook like this.
  18. Nook

    Nook Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    53,805
    Likes Received:
    111,568
    I thought for sure he was going to say.... “the Holocaust“ or maybe “Mexican kids in cages” or “Forcing Palestinians off their land.”
     
  19. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2000
    Messages:
    18,223
    Likes Received:
    13,425

    [​IMG]

    And Melania is thankful for small mercies.
     
  20. Amiga

    Amiga I get vaunted sacred revelations from social media
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Messages:
    21,710
    Likes Received:
    18,486
    Official Statement From Mormon Women for Ethical Government on the House Impeachment Vote

    https://www.mormonwomenforethicalgo...cal-government-on-the-house-impeachment-vote/

    December 18, 2019

    We assert that our most sacred civic expression is the casting of an individual vote. Any president or leader who forces political support and fails to honor and protect the free and legitimate elections on which our republic rests has lost the moral right to govern. By attempting to compel Ukraine to announce investigations benefitting only his re-election efforts, President Trump forced every American taxpayer to become an unwitting contributor to his political campaign and a supporter of his re-election.

    Regardless of the behavior of any other political actor in either party, the president of the United States is never justified in bringing our common resources and might to bear against a political rival. As an organization committed to the defense of ethical government, we feel an urgent need to speak in defense of our norms and institutions. The House of Representatives produced the required articles, following procedures previously established, and voted through a legislatively approved process. They have fulfilled their constitutional obligation.

    When presented to the Senate, these articles deserve a full and fair trial with impartial jurors, conducted as required by the Constitution. Even in an era of polarized partisan politics, truth is discernible and powerful. The Senate must resist all impulse to reduce this process to gamesmanship and theater and instead must pursue truth by compelling testimony from the actors at the heart of this inquiry. The president himself must honor his sworn duty to uphold the law by providing the documents Congress has subpoenaed and instructing his staff to testify. If he is innocent, their testimonies will be exculpatory. Subversion of this process, regardless of outcome, represents a subversion of justice.

    At MWEG we are committed peacemakers. However, we recognize that true peace is not an absence of conflict. Rather, it requires, as Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. taught, a courageous defense of truth and justice. Some argue that an impeachment process must be bi-partisan before it is legitimate. Some say that without Congressional Republican support, investigating the president would be too divisive. We reject this argument as one devoid of moral authority. Peace cannot be purchased so cheaply. Effective leadership does not sacrifice truth and principle on the altar of consensus. Instead, it gives voice to truth and lends courage to those who are fearful. Our nation is truly indivisible only when there is liberty and justice for all.

    While we speak to all of our fellow citizens and elected officials, we call specifically upon our co-religionists Senators Mike Lee (R-Utah), Mitt Romney (R-Utah), Mike Crapo (R-Idaho), and Tom Udall (D-New Mexico) to honor their oaths of office. We remind them that this oath qualifies them for service and was taken in the name of God. The oath of office does not require our representatives to protect the economy, their political party, their seat, their ambition, or even the president. It demands that those sworn to office will uphold the Constitution and fairly adjudicate on behalf of every citizen. We expect them to honor that oath, and we will hold them to account with our votes.
     
    No Worries and FranchiseBlade like this.

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now