ESPN “Experts” Rank the Top 74 Players in NBA History

u can''t possibly be this dense !
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jerry west, oscar robertson, willis reed, rick barry, etc played in the 60s, no?

 

in 10 years Harden > Curry

 

provided Harden wins a ring

 

Pace. That is the #1 reason. In terms of rebounding, there were a ton more shots taken and at a significantly lower percentage. That meant more rebounds were available.

Baylor was still an excellent rebounder for his size, but not whatever spot he has on the all-time rebounds per game list.

All of those players would be ranked higher if we took their stats at face value. 60s players just had to do something special to make it into the top 10 area. Oscar Robertson had to be the first to average a triple-double. Jerry West, IMO, was the better player when you took into account clutchness and defense, but Robertson almost always gets the nod due to his triple-double season(s?).

It's math. Rodman's advanced rebounding numbers are truly epic and untouchable. Wilt's and Russell's estimated rebound rates are still great, especially Wilt in the regular season and Russell in the playoffs, but not at Rodman's level. Believe it or not.

 

Clyde should have gone higher than Westbrook. The guy has a title and was mainly overshadowed by MJ.

 

again, u have no idea what u are talking about.

there were HoF center / power forward in the 60s, Willis Reed, Nate Thurmond, Zelmo Beatty, Kareem, etc. who avg way less rebounds than baylor, a sf

the most dominating defensive / offensive / rebounders of all time, Bill Russell and Chamberlain played in the 60s

Baylor had to contend w these dominant rebounders to get rebound,
who did Rodman contend to get his rebounds ?​

it was an era of a Center-dominated style of play. more 1/2 court play, the pace was slower, less shots taken

he O vs jerry west dynamics was MORE a case of east coast bias among the sports journalist. most of them only see West play when Lakers traveled to their city to play
Lakers home games were on after their bed time. less than half of the games were televised nationally

u can't possibly be this ignorant

 

TrIpLe DoUbLeS!

 

Well Rodman had to contend with Malone, Olajuwon, Mourning, Ewing, and Daugherty?

 

thank you making my point, as rebounders, these guys can't even hold Russell / Chamberlain's jock straps

and, next to Jerry West, Dream is my favorite baller of all time,​

 

I'm not saying that Baylor wasn't a great rebounder. But he just wasn't historically great compared to any other great rebounding BIGS.

If I could find it, I'll post a spreadsheet I made with the estimated rebound rates of 60s players. The elite still stayed elite, but guys like Baylor and Robertson were simply great in terms of their positions.

That's not true.

That's one theory.

Don't tell me what I can't be.

 

like who?

 

like who ?

i repeat, Baylor's rebounding was better than every other PF/C from his era, who were elected to HoF, not named Russell and Chamberlain.

these HoFers included Wes Unseld, Willis Reed, Dave DeBushire, Thurmond, Beatty, etc.​

yet another eg of u not knowing what ur talking about.

nba in the 1960s was center-dominated, half court play.
because this was before the 3-pt shot rule was in effect, a lot less shots were taken

Rodman play in the 3-pt shot era, a lot more shots were taken, lots of missed 3-pt attempts

 

So what would you say was a bigger impact rule change: the 24-second shot clock or the 3-point line?

 

https://www.wbur.org/onlyagame/2015/04/22/nba-shot-clock-history-basketball

On April 22, 1954, facing a scoring drought of epic proportions, NBA owners voted to implement a 24-second shot clock. The decision changed the league and the game of basketball.

Before that vote, the NBA had a problem: a low-scoring, time-killing breed of basketball was taking over the league. Teams tried to get the lead and then hang onto the ball until time ran out. In 1950, the Fort Wayne Pistons defeated the Minneapolis Lakers 19-18, the lowest scoring NBA game on record.​

 

u suffer from recency bias.

And for good reason. For example, Baylor's rebounding raw numbers are crazy, but his estimated rebound rates put him at about a Shawn Marion level.

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talk about meaninfless stat.

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chamberlain, russell, west, baylor played in an era when starters play almost the entire game. in fact, for several seasons, Chamberlain avg > 48 min a game.

in rodman's era ballers take several breaks in a game. i like to see Rodman estimated rebound rates when his plays the entire game,

 

we all know the MVP is a joke and he stole hardens. He hardly revolutionized game considering the Rockets shot way more threes than the Warriors and the media just wants to give them the credit. Hell I could say we created the Warriors because we set the nba record for three points made against them the season before they were good.

Lastly I think he would have won 0 titles if he wasn’t lucky to play every team injured on his way to the first ring. He’s playoff performances have been trash. His finals performances have been trash. Without KD he has nothing. Durant accomplishes way more in his career. No one fears curry. Everyone just attacks him. KD is the greatest offensive weapon in NbA history. Only thing that can stop him is an injury. And I hate both of them. Being a leader is not the same as being the best player. We are voting best players not best leaders.

It’s like saying CP3 was better than Harden. Because we all know he was a better leader the last two years. But harden by far the superior player.

 

Anybody who doesn't have Hakeem in their top 8 is no expert at all.

ESPN, you now know who needs firing.

 

see now i think you're just trolling. you can go to www.basketball-reference.com and look at the average number of rebounds per game every season. at one point in the early 60's (baylor's era), it was 73 rpg. for most of the last 30-40 years it's been in the low- to mid-40s. there were nearly 75% more rebounds per game in the early 60's. these are just facts recorded in a box score, not opinions of style of play.

exactly. it was much easier to play big minutes back in the day (as we know modern athletes are much more physically fit and have much better access to training and nutrition, etc). so if there were 73 rebounds and the starting 5 stayed on the court damn near the whole game, the average player could probably get 11-12 rpg just for showing up. now it dropped off fairly drastically in the late 60's but was still high by modern standards and minutes per game were still really high.

edit: over 70 rpg for 5 straight years from '57-'62 and then 6 more years of 66+ rebounds per game. after the first year, that's the first 10 years of baylor's career. take the '63-'64 season. baylor fell off to 12 rpg. sounds good. but there were 65.9 rpg and baylor played 40.6 mpg. if the lakers grabbed an average number of rebounds, baylor was grabbing 21.5% of his teams rebounds when he was on the court. which is basically what you would expect the small forward to do (grab 1/5 of the rebounds).

also, it's amazing how quickly baylor fell off. he had a great first 5 years and then his numbers just crash. did he have a big injury? his numbers basically stay at that level until he's 35 so that's somewhat impressive longevity, but still really only 5 great years.

 

yeah he may have largely invented the 30 foot 3, which basically no one took before him and now a lot do, but you could easily say daryl morey is the biggest influence on how modern basketball is played, and he's not a coach or player. he spread the gospel of the 3 and now the rockets can barely stay ahead of other teams for most 3PA per game and everybody on the court launches away.