1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

[OFFICIAL] Amy Klobuchar for President thread

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Os Trigonum, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    72,469
    Likes Received:
    110,423
    and THAT'S just really well stated. strong work. :D
     
    Jayzers_100, Astrodome and B-Bob like this.
  2. AkeemTheDreem86

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2007
    Messages:
    3,019
    Likes Received:
    1,494
    Thanks, now I'm hungry!

    As much as I love the enthusiasm and excitement Sanders and Warren bring, I just don't see forcing people off their existing health plans as good policy, much less good election strategy.

    Republicans (successfully) use the stereotype of the knee-jerk liberal to excite their base, and I just don't think Klobuchar falls into that. I think she can actually win.
     
    Jayzers_100 and B-Bob like this.
  3. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 1999
    Messages:
    34,061
    Likes Received:
    13,410
    I suppose much of it comes from the fact that he went from a virtual nobody in the 2008 election (Dennis Kucinich got more primary votes than him before being named VP) to the favored candidate in 2020, a stark improvement built pretty much entirely on the popularity of Barack Obama. Before that, he had one good win in 1972 when he beat the incumbent Republican for Senate and he's been sitting on his laurels ever since. And I don't want to belittle his VP experience (where he did seem actively involved in government) or his campaigning experience in 2008 and 2012, but if we're honest we know his poll numbers are really Obama's reflected glory.

    So, when Trump starts fighting dirty, does he have the campaigning meddle to counter? Trump will have 50 different attacks to go at him with, ranging from the made-up Ukraine stuff, to his gaffes and weird way of touching people, to the decisions of the Obama Admin, to all the legislation he helped pass from the 1970s to the aughts. He's a big target. He was slow to react to the Ukraine thing, and imo not very effective. He has also seemed slow to counter Warren's rising popularity (maybe that's just good strategy, I don't know). But when the Trump haymakers start coming, I worry he's going to be back on his heels all the time because he doesn't seem to have the risk appetite and the energy to do more.

    Of course, asking Bideners to jump to Klobuchar is probably not a rational thing, and I can probably only be cavalier about it because I don't like Biden anyway. We don't really know that Klobuchar can actually handle a national election either. We see already that, even though nobody seems to dislike her, nobody can manage to be excited either. She needs to do something besides what she's doing to inspire some actual confidence.
     
    Jayzers_100 and joshuaao like this.
  4. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2015
    Messages:
    21,011
    Likes Received:
    16,853
    Initially I thought you meant Trust as in he might do something nefarious but I actually agree with everything you have noted.

    If this was the Biden of 2012 I would have no issues but he has definitely lost several steps.
     
    Jayzers_100 and B-Bob like this.
  5. baller4life315

    baller4life315 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2003
    Messages:
    12,648
    Likes Received:
    2,910
    She got some bad advice early on to refuse to target fellow Democrats and only focus on Trump. Noble strategy...but also foolish whenever your goal is to draw contrast and differentiate yourself.

    That was a costly error she made in the first two debates, but she has since turned up the heat. She hit Bernie pretty hard in the third debate and she was all over Warren during the last debate.

    The result? A record 24 hours of fundraising post debate #4, modest gains in the polls and qualifying for both November/December debates.

    Bottom line: she’s quietly hanging around and playing the long game. She likely sees the same thing we all see: vulnerability in the candidates currently polling ahead of her.

    I expect her to be very aggressive in the next debate. Good things seem to happen whenever she goes on the offensive.
     
  6. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 1999
    Messages:
    34,061
    Likes Received:
    13,410
    I threw someone off earlier when I said I didn't "trust" Tulsi. In Tulsi's case, I meant I don't trust her wisdom; in Biden's case I mean I don't trust his electioneering chops. Maybe yall are right and I need to expand my vocabulary.
     
  7. ThatBoyNick

    ThatBoyNick Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2011
    Messages:
    28,280
    Likes Received:
    43,345
    If Biden fades, I don't think Klobuchar will be the one to rise from his fall. I think that's clearly Pete.

    Going off of fundraising, Bernie Warren and Pete are by far ahead of everyone else. All 3 have double the money to spend over Biden. Biden so far in the polls, is obviously coasting off on name recognition, as his fundraising is clearly showing he doesn't have a strong base of supporters.
     
    joshuaao and FranchiseBlade like this.
  8. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    41,383
    Likes Received:
    15,808
    Name recognition is irrelevant at this point. Anyone who's paying attention to primaries knows who Bernie and Warren are - Biden's support 6 months ago could be attributed to it, but if voters haven't learned who the others are by now, they are doing an extremely poor job of campaigning. Biden's fundraising is certainly poor, but it's because he's not running much of a primary campaign - he isn't the excitement candidate and he's not going to generate tons of small donors from a liberal base.

    But money is also way overrated in the modern campaign because of FB/Twitter/etc and the ability to reach so many people at little cost thanks to modern media. Hillary nearly doubled Trump in fundraising in 2016, for example ($1.2B to $600MM), but that didn't translate to voters. # of donors is a good measure of excitement from the base, but beyond that, money is less relevant than it used to be.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/graphics/2016-presidential-campaign-fundraising/
     
    Nook and baller4life315 like this.
  9. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2003
    Messages:
    47,267
    Likes Received:
    16,710
    I think it's easy to forget just how disengaged the majority of Americans are when we spend all of our time colliding with other people who are highly engaged here. Even in Iowa and New Hampshire it's only a minority of a minority who are tuned in at this point (and even of those who are tuned in over two thirds of them say they are open to supporting a new candidate). We like to think we're not the outliers, but we absolutely are.
     
  10. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    41,383
    Likes Received:
    15,808
    I'd agree with that - but I'd also argue that those people are likely also not going to be early state primary voters, so their opinions will largely be shaped based on those early state results (which is why polls move so dramatically post-Iowa and why Biden really needs to figure out a way to not finish 3rd or 4th). I think Iowa, especially, because of its retail politicking and time consuming caucus system, those voters are likely already heavily engaged. That's one thing that makes Mayor Pete's rise there interesting. I don't know that he has a future past New Hampshire due to his lack of minority support, but if Biden falters and moderates are looking for a candidate, he and Klobuchar are the only real options. It's possible the lack-of-early-interest may be a boon to someone like them if they can shape the post-Iowa narrative.

    I went back and looked at 2008, and just prior to Iowa, the national polls were 44% Hillary, 24% Obama. A week later, it was 39-34%. Hillary did regain ground over the next several weeks until after South Carolina, when Obama surged and eventually took the lead. So the race is definitely more fluid than we sometimes give it credit for.
     
    mikol13 and FranchiseBlade like this.
  11. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    41,383
    Likes Received:
    15,808
    I thought this was interesting as well, to Donny's point about people not being engaged too much yet. Basically, no one has done any TV ads yet at all.

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/28/politics/tom-steyer-2020-advertising-spending/index.html

    So far this year, 2020 presidential candidates have spent almost $41 million on TV ads promoting their campaigns. Which is interesting!

    But not nearly as interesting as this: Candidates not named "Tom Steyer" have spent just $6 million on TV ads, according to CNN's David Wright. Meaning that Steyer, the billionaire Democrat, has dropped more than $35 million on ads in support of a candidacy that appears to be almost entirely lifeless.
     
  12. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2000
    Messages:
    17,773
    Likes Received:
    3,388
    I guess that explains how he got on the debate(s). I heard he spent a lot on fb.
     
  13. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2000
    Messages:
    17,773
    Likes Received:
    3,388
    debater ok. campaigner ok. effective Senator? Ony for the status quo. Obama firs t
    Castro is doing well as a potential VP candidate. Kamala not so well as she isn't even doing that well in California or with AA voters
     
  14. adoo

    adoo Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2003
    Messages:
    9,509
    Likes Received:
    6,049
    on Facebook, Klobuchar posted

    ......the difference between DJ Trump and Greenland is that
    Greenland is not for sale

     
    FranchiseBlade likes this.
  15. Jayzers_100

    Jayzers_100 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2013
    Messages:
    3,234
    Likes Received:
    2,877
    Booker and Klobuchar have been my favorite candidates since day one. I’m surprised they haven’t risen in the polls. Granted, their name recognition is lacking. I think either would throttle Trump in a general election though
     
  16. astros123

    astros123 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Messages:
    9,412
    Likes Received:
    6,762
    [​IMG]


    I made my first donation of the year! I love her campaign. Why the fk are the democrat nots getting behind her? She's smart, moderate, from the midwest, has support from Republican colleagues, educated, etc. I think she would do fantastic against Trump and she knows how to debate.


    LOVE HER!
     
  17. No Worries

    No Worries Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 1999
    Messages:
    29,839
    Likes Received:
    16,693
    which means Jack ****.
     
    ThatBoyNick likes this.
  18. astros123

    astros123 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Messages:
    9,412
    Likes Received:
    6,762
    Its your type of attitude that will be the downfall of this country. Its time for someone to unite the moderates together.
     
    Corrosion and Jayzers_100 like this.
  19. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2002
    Messages:
    55,908
    Likes Received:
    47,610
    [THROWS STAPLER] WHY ARE YOU TRYING TO BLAME ME!!! [BEGINS VIOLENTLY WEEPING]
     
    ThatBoyNick and Nook like this.
  20. Jayzers_100

    Jayzers_100 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2013
    Messages:
    3,234
    Likes Received:
    2,877
    I’m about to donate as well
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now