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Trump's coronavirus response

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Two Sandwiches, Mar 13, 2020.

  1. Fantasma Negro

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  2. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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    Would you refuse to believe he is the version conservatives portray him as?
     
  3. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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    Do you think these tests are actually "free"?
    Who actually pays for them?
     
  4. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    I am not sure where you are going with this line of questioning. Of course things aren't free. Are you being purposely obtuse on this issue? The American people were told there would be free (to the consumer) testing. You, yourself, said there was free testing. There is not nationwide free testing widely available to all who request one.
     
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  5. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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  6. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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    And there is.
    How many countries have 100% free tests and more readily available than us?
     
  7. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    US, India, Brazil are some of the countries that do not have it contained with still high # of new cases per day.

    Most modern countries do not have high # cases. That may still happen, but as of present and for the past few months, most of EU and Asian have it under control.

    The US went down from a peak of ~30k new cases daily to ~20k new cases daily . Now it's ~50k cases daily. I wouldn't consider ~20k new cases per day under control.

    Trump and his admin pushed hard to re-open and many states followed his lead, against CDC guidelines. That's a major reason for the spike.

    https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus#the-current-case-fatality-rate-of-covid-19
     
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  8. AleksandarN

    AleksandarN Member

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    Nope I think conservatives have him spot on.

     
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  9. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

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    In contact tracing, tell people where they got exposed, who exposed them.
    Require public schools to post their numbers of positive cases.
    Publish names of everyone who tests positive.
    Require masks in schools.
    Require tests (which you claim are free) before returning to school and every two weeks or so.
    Do not force people to work in unsafe workplaces: make it voluntary like the NBA.
    President wear a mask and act like an adult.
    Manufacture some f'ing masks and PPE, as a nation.
    Don't abuse power of the federal government by trying to control state responses.
    Don't dismiss the search for where the virus came from. Its source is the key to a vaccine.
    Make Trump's kid go to public school.
    Show public service announcements of people suffocating to death from COVID over several days' time.
    Everyone stop being selfish ******* Americans, but that's who we are :)
     
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  10. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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    US numbers have flattened and have declined. Florida is one example.

    Most, not all.

    Cases declined, deaths mysteriously increased.

    So you believe all the pressure to reopen came only from the Trump admin? Seriously - you think the thousands and thousands of businesses across the country (not to mention employees) didn't want to reopen when the worst seemed to be over back in June?
     
    #4530 Wattafan, Aug 9, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2020
  11. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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    Then there's this.
     
  12. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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    Okay, the first contradicts the second. Still.
    Then, the national response would still be inadequate whichever way it went would it not? It's a lose lose situation for any government.

    So then, he was correct.
    Thanks for pointing that out.
     
  13. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    The only reason Florida's cases declined earlier this week is most testing was canceled last weekend due to the storm threat. Cases are heading back up this week.
     
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  14. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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    Cases declined nationally, but strangely, deaths increased.
    One explanation is that any coronavirus related death in US is counted in the death toll.
    Many other countries only count those that are solely caused by corona with no other underlying illnesses.
     
  15. deb4rockets

    deb4rockets Contributing Member
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    There are also tons of tests and deaths that aren't even reported or counted. When someone dies at home or enroute to a hospital they aren't even required to be tested or counted. Rapid tests aren't even counted in some states.
     
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  16. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    Yes, most not all. The point is many modern nations have it contained for months now. The US is an outliner, along with India and Brazil.

    There is pressure to open businesses not just here in the US but everywhere else in the world. The gov and it’s leadership can communicate and explain and dictate when to re-open. Most modern countries have done a good enough job to re-open “safely”. We have failed miserably. That’s on the gov and poor leadership. You probably do remember trump pushing for full churches for Easter, which I don’t think there was much pressure to do that, and thankfully he backed down. He didn’t back down on pushing to re-open. His leadership created the pressure or at minimum supplement the pressure to re-open. He was deadly wrong.

    Today, he’s putting direct pressure on school to have in person class with his threat to withhold fed funds. It may be another disaster if states with widespread cases follow his lead on this. Is there pressure from school, teacher, parent to have in person education ? Yes, but if only it can be done safely - and I believe 60+% don’t feel it can yet open safely for in person education. Trump IS taking a lead here with his push for in person education - like he did with businesses. To me it’s a reckless gamble. Federal gov should provide clear guidance and funding for safe in person school (the cdc does have some guidance but I believe it the admin pushed back on it) and enable locals to best manage it. Threat of withholding fund, ignoring the cdc guidance and pressuring locals is the opposite of that.

    What I’m trying to said with the education and business example is trump wasn’t just idle doing nothing - he lead but it was reckless and a gamble. Things he didn’t push for that would help with re-opening are effective wide area testing for all (instead he complain about testing too much), trace and isolation system, adherence to the cdc guidance (none of the state met the criteria for re-opening), mask for all (instead he lead with no mask), ...

    I think you can also look up north to our friend in Canada and see how they are doing vs us. We failed miserably and it didn’t have to be that way. The surprise failure in feb and March was due to not being prepare. The non-surprise failure since then was due to reckless gamble and continuing to not do the hard but do-able work needed to open up safely.
     
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  17. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    death is a lagging indicator and that’s why it didn’t go up for weeks when cases started to spike. What you see now for death is from cases weeks ago. It will takes weeks, after cases decline, for it to go back down.
     
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  18. Wattafan

    Wattafan Member

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    Possibly true but I would have to see stats and not just assume it.
    And our reporting system would be right at or very near to the top by world standards.
     
  19. Dubious

    Dubious Contributing Member

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    TBF Trumps choice was deep recession or pandemic. Since economic collapse is a proven loser, he chose to go with the unknown option.

    Couldn't happen to a nicer guy.
     
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  20. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    The cdc estimate 10x the number of cases. Death is very likely an undercount, especially early on through April. I’m not sure about now.
     
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