Would you sign Kimbrel or Keuchel for 1 year 15mil?

I assume the FO trots out better than keuchel for that game with a deadline acquisition. If they don’t you are correct, not bringing him back would be a huge miss as it was always about the playoffs with the rest of this roster.

 

Goodness gracious! Did he have sex with your wife or something?

 

Nah. Just not a fan. He strikes me as an arrogant loudmouth. That’s less fun when he profiles as average-ish from here on out.

 

Oh man, you should've been here for the Kenneth Robert Giles days. Half of the forum hated him and called him a suck ass loser and half of the forum defended him as being "NAILS". From your viewpoints here, I'd say you didn't like him very much either.

But wot on the Marwin front, why?

 

Marwin Gonzalez may not be the most charismatic dude, but you are simply not allowed to not like him as an Astros fan. C'mon.

That's like saying you don't like Mario Elie or Robert Horry as a Rockets fan.

 

Not a Giles fan. Also a meathead.

 

Loved big shot bob and Ellie. I lived bill sports so it’s not like I am anti utility guys. Hell, my most controversial like is probably mr Butt Slide himself, Villar. My point is everyone has different takes and preferences. I like Correa better than Bregman for example. That makes me an island of one in astros fandom I think.

 

Damn bro

I’m glad we are winning despite all the injuries or I would hate to see how angry and miserable you would be

 

I’m not miserable at all. That’s my point. It’s not about winning and losing for me. I started threads on GARM saying ease off in the negativity, whatcha gonna do when you run into a buzz saw.
I respect the fact that the rockets took their best shot twice in a row and missed. No shame in that.
I chuckle at keuchel costing himself probably 30 million in turning down his extension in 2016, or costing himself 5 million this year. That’s just how I am. I’m way more about actualization and process than results. I value other things outside of winning as much as winning. 2017 was amazing bc my team won it all but they did it with seemingly a ton of good dudes. The least (seeming to me bc who knows) good dudes on that team seemed to be Keuchel and Marwin. The joy and passion which everyone else seemed to possess was awesome.

 

I like the injures too. It gives Mayfield the chance to live a dream. It gives fisher a chance to show his skills. You get interviews like with Stubbs dad.
Even if we went 500 while the guys were on the shelf (or worse) I’d have enjoyed all that.
I respect Brady Rodgers for being all he can be (even if it’s not good enough to be a big leaguer) and getting a couple shots at living the dream.
All that said, I want the team healthy in October so they can put their best foot forward.

 

I find it ironic you think Keuchel and Martin because they are arrogant but you like Correa who “won’t even consider a deal prior to free agency”.

 

Yea I love Correa and hope he stays here long term, but he is about as arrogant as anyone in Houston Sports

 

I like Correa bc I find him fascinating and intriguing. He’s the most interesting player I’ve ever rooted for in the sense he could be an inner ballot hall of famer or just a good player in the Berkman/Oswalt territory. That’s exciting for me, personally. I root for him to actualize and see generational greatness.

Correa could become Hakeem in spikes. Or he might not. I’m rooting for the former.

 

1. Correa would struggle to have the kind of curveball Oswalt had
2. Correa is about as surly as Berkman was, so i'll give you that one
3. I know he plays a lot of basketball, but no way he he could block shots like Dream, much less "the shake"
4. Is this Brad?

 

Sometimes the line is thin between self confident and self important. Usually the tipping point is how outspoken they are.

 

FIFY

That's all people care about. If he were still an ace level pitcher everybody would love him. It aggravates me to no end how fans are that way, but it is what it is.

I'm pretty open that I only care about results, but I never suddenly start to hate a player on a personal level just because they stop performing at a desired level (Ryan Anderson sends his regards). If I was fine with his arrogance (confidence) when he's good, it shouldn't bother me when he isn't as good.

 

I think the point was that the 5/90 offer was below market value when the offer was made (I.e, in 2016 and not in 2019). DK was one of the most dominant pitchers in the game at that point. For reference, Rich Hill got 3/48, Chapman, Jansen, Fowler all got 5/80, and Melancon got 4/62. In all likelihood, at that point, I think it’s pretty certain that one team offers more than 5/90 if DK is a FA at that point.

All in all, it was a very different climate in 2016, and DK rejecting 5/90 was not some crazy decision based on the market at the time (and in the past, for right or wrong).

If you read my post closely, you’ll see that I stated “appreciate”, not “like”. You don’t have to like DK. Even for whatever stupid reasons you listed (which, as an aside, seem like an immature stretch). Do you actually know DK personally? His arrogance and hubris lost him money? Lmao. Look at the contracts handed out from 2013-2017. If anything, he was just misguided and didn’t anticipate 2/3rds of the league markedly changing how they approach payroll. All I’m saying is that real Astro’s fans *appreciate* what he did for this organization during his time here. You don’t have to like him. That’s all I’m saying.

 

But Keuchel wasn't a free agent at that point. The Astros were also not obligated to even offer him that extension.

Keuchel, and his agent, should have discussed whether or not he'd be likely to get the same years or contract value 3 years later... with more wear/tear, expected age-related regression, and then possible market forces working against them.

Baseball contracts didn't just magically start declining. There was, even in 2016, a push to offer starting pitchers less overall years, and the Astros model of sucking but rebounding had already started taking on emulators.

My preference is for teams to be somewhat obligated to offer mid-arbitration players these sort of extensions... or the player gets early free agency. In this scenario, the Astros met their end of the criteria. The player still has the right to refuse if they think they can get more money overall later (and the player just continues making the arbitration amount on a year to year basis). The team also can refuse, but then the player should automatically be a free agent earlier... when they have more prime years.

 

That’s fair, I’m not here to tell you who to like and who not to like. Hopefully it didn’t come off that way, I was just surprised. Everyone has their reasons for their favorite players and players they dislike, and most of the time those reasons aren’t very rational.

I think Correa’s issue is going to be his healthy - the injuries he’s had are concerning (e.g. neck, back and now broken ribs from a massage?).

 

The no flinch attitude Keutchel displayed early on seems integral to his nature. I recalled how Keutchel pitched with the same confidence if he had the bases empty or the bases were loaded. It was something special, I think that confidence rubbed off onto guys like Altuve, McCullers, Harris, etc... But that is when those type of people need to surround themselves with people who can keep the grounded, not those that will fill your head with more bravado. Scott Borras was not doing him any favors, he sold Keutchel the selected data he excelled in, and well Keutchel bought it!

The market changed, and the agents responsibility to advise his client. Maybe it works for Keutchel and next year he gets a 150 million dollar contract for 5 years. But that is to be determined, but I won’t bet against Keutchel